Donner: honour killings are not terrorism (Women Not Targets of Terror?)

expatica ^ | 4 Feb 2005 | expatica

[Cornpone]

AMSTERDAM — Justice Minister Piet Hein Donner has rejected a call by MP Ayaan Hirsi Ali to use the intelligence service AIVD to tackle honour killings.

Speaking on radio on Friday, Donner said honour crimes and killings were "ordinary crimes" and would continue to be treated as such.

Hirsi Ali said in an interview with newspaper De Volkskrant that the police should not only go after the person who actually carries out the killing but also the family members involved in the planning.

She suggested the AIVD should be used to gather evidence against all the guilty members of the family. Under the new anti-terror law, AIVD agents can give evidence in open court about the results of their investigations. Prior to this, such evidence was shielded by State secrecy laws.

In some cultures, family members decide to kill a relative — usually a woman or girl — because they believe she has disgraced the family. The Somali-born MP said the intelligence services could be used against the families of 100 women who are in hiding in shelters around the Netherlands.

[Cornpone]

Incredulous. Any man that finds honor in killing a woman will find honor in blowing up a train and killing innocent 200 passengers or flying an airplane into a building and killing 3000 innocents. This is honor? Notice how they skirt the issue of what men are the predominate perpetrators…Muslims. And, they do this so deftly in spite of the fact that the one bringing the issue forward is Hirsi Ali, the Somali born PM who has been outspoken against Islam’s abuse of women and who went into hiding after the murder of Theo van Gogh with whom she made a film protesting Islamic women’s abuse. The Dutch should give Muslim women sanctuary, pursue and convict their torturers, and seek any intelligence they can from them.

[mercy]

Don't cry too loud and long. Most of the victims, if they lived, would raise their male children to be equal to or worse than the brute savages who killed her.

[SweetPilotofCanuckistan]

"In some cultures, family members decide to kill a relative"

Some cultures? Why can't they just say Fundamentalist Islam!

[Paleo Conservative]

Donner

I wonder if he had any relatives who migrated to California in the 1840s.

[RetroWarrior]

Honor killings occur in Latin American cultures too, honor killing predate Islam (tho most occur in Middle Eastern countries,) so it's more of a global problem

http://womensissues.about.com/cs/honorkillings/a/honorkillings.htm

[RetroWarrior]

I was thinking the same thing. Donner party of 7, uh, 6, well, I guess it's down to 5 now.

[Paleo Conservative]

Honor killings occur in Latin American cultures too,

Well Spain was dominated by Muslims for 800 years.

[sarasmom]

You assume that the women of despotic Islamic cults secretly do not approve of cult rules, and that they seek help in freeing themselves from barbarism.

Do not equate the motivations of willing veil wearers with free women.

Am I the only person here who retains any memory of the devastations deviant cultish leaders had over ignorant "spiritualist seekers" in the 1980s?

[RetroWarrior]

I can't understand why anyone would find it honorable to kill out of spite.

[spetznaz]

It gets ridiculous. In Pakistan and Bangladesh men have been known to slay their sisters once they are raped. Think about that for a second. The dude is killing his own sister, after she has been raped. It is not as if she went forth sleeping around. She was assaulted!

In Saudi Arabia women are beaten if men are noticed looking at them. The rationale is that the woman must have done something to 'attract the attention.'

It is really sad some of the things women have to go through in Islamic nations (from Nigeria to the Sudan to Yemen to Pakistan all the way to Saudi Arabia). They are valued less than animals (for example in the Gulf falcons and horses are valued much higher than any woman).

IT just doesn't make any sense how someone can kill their daughter or sister because of what some other man did to her. It is really saddening.

[RetroWarrior]

It is apparent that these people hate woman to the point of psychosis, yet originations such as NOW have remained silent on this. Where is the voice of the Liberals? Don't they care?

[RetroWarrior]

I wonder if this passes Kerry's Global Test?

[Cornpone]

In case they don't know it yet...the War on Terror is a Women's War.

[LoudRepublicangirl]

They only care when a woman wants the right to kill her baby or a 14 year old girl wants to get on birthcontrol pills without her parents knowledge. Those are causes that NOW feels are worthy.

[RetroWarrior]

Ahh, but we must be sensitive of other's believes.

/sarcasm

[RetroWarrior]

So, Men can kill Woman (honor killings,) Woman can kill Babies (abortion,) but our troops can not kill terrorists? And woe be to anyone who harms a protected species! WTF?

[spetznaz]

Liberals only care when it suits them. They will moan and groan if one jailed terrorist has a panty placed on his head, since that will fit their agenda, but will look away when wholescale genocide is occuring (eg Rwanda) because it is just not on their daily planner for the year!

If you want them to be involved then have an American soldier hit a muslim woman in Iraq. All Liberal groups you know will be up in arms over that!

[LoudRepublicangirl]

So, Men can kill Woman (honor killings,) Woman can kill Babies (abortion,) but our troops can not kill terrorists? And woe be to anyone who harms a protected species! WTF?

To the left-good is bad and bad is good.

[RetroWarrior]

Evil, pure and simple. Until I joined the Army and was stationed in Germany, I didn't believe in evil. Then I saw first hand what the terrorists were capable of. That changed me forever.

I came back home and began to question everything I had been taught in school (I live in Minneapolis, a Democratic stronghold.) I read the Star and Tribune, watched the news, and began to see the evil everywhere I looked.

That's when I became a Conservative. Not that there isn't evil among Conservatives, but there was a lot more good than evil. I just hope it's enough.