Posted on 12/04/2004 7:12:24 PM PST by chashand
I'll not quibble with the stats, but I can correct you as to the blame.
President Bush never called his proposal a amnesty of any kind. No once!
Some one else made that charge and that is what brought the additional people.
Someone else called it amnesty.
Tried and failed as a result of courts,lawyers and the tons of money required.
The only hope we have through out current laws and protections is to get the counterfeit paperwork stopped.
I heard that recently we have made some gains in this area and I look forward to more news on this.
That would leave plenty of them out of work and voluntarily returning home.
Now to address the why they come problem, is the worker permit idea that matches available jobs with willing and documented "now legal" visitors and not illegals. This should take the pressure off the border if it all is done together.IMO
I agree with most of your thoughts but disagree with inability to place responsibility on employers. I envision something like the requirement IRS places - i.e., it is up to the employer to maintain, report and, if requested, produce records of employee status on demand. Failure to do so would incur severe financial, and where warranted, criminal penalties. Financial penalties would 1) Assist in funding rewards for informants and 2) Make the employment of illegals so unrewarding a financial proposition that employers would not have any financial incentive to aid and abet illegals and those who profit by importing them. At the same time, tightening up the availability of social benefits would further reduce the incentives for illegal immigration. Finally, and perhaps most controversial, amend the Constitution to eliminate the automatic granting if citizenship to anyone born in the US. Instead, the birth should be to a legal citizen - period.
I live in Miami.
English is already the second language of this community.
You are totally right about "supply side" labor issues -- See this post from earlier today:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1291568/posts?page=112#112
please ping me if you find the link, transcript or video on this.
actually the radical Aztlan group is seeking a takeover of the western portion of the USA, "taking it back" from us. This is about a LOT more than day labor and gardening services....
FTAA - Free trade (not so free for us), open borders from Canada to the tip of South America, the dumbing down of America, redistribution of wealth, the death of sovereignty. Next stop, third world status with the sheep easily herded. It's the New World Order, doncha know? Socalist paradise.
Big time BOY HOWDE on that one, I have to go along with the "what the heck is George thinking" thing on this one. The "SS argument" is not valid, the "cheap corporate labor" argument is not valid, the "it is not against the law" argument is not valid.
I sure hope there is the "Clearance 7000 U.L.T.R.A. MegaCode 4 Dimensional Hologram Security" reason why the current administration is ignoring a FULL-BLOWN-INVASION across the mexican border.
Cause if it ain't, I gotta `nuther way of responding.
Yep. These guys have been playing shell games and feeding us a line of propaganda for so long, they think that's all it takes to weasle by - still. I don't think the realization has yet fully hit them that those days are done and overwith.
Immigration and offshoring are two issues I knew would boil to a head. I thought it would take longer than it is. But it appears the lines have been drawn and the come to Jesus moment has arrived. And it's apparent among some politicians who are cutting off conversation when nailed lying on the subject that
some of them get it - at least partially. Many do not. And I'm not real confident that they realize fully the gravity of the situation.
Go Try This, Go Ahead - I Dare You! If you have a Death Wish!
Enter Mexico illegally. Never mind immigration quotas, visas, international law, or any of that nonsense.
Once there, demand that the local government provide free medical care for you and your entire family.
Demand bilingual nurses and doctors.
Demand free bilingual local government forms, bulletins, etc. Procreate abundantly.
Deflect any criticism of this allegedly irresponsible reproductive behavior with,"It is a cultural United States thing. You would not understand, pal."
Keep your American identity strong. Fly Old Glory from your rooftop, or proudly display it in your front window or on your car bumper.
Speak only English at home and in public and insist that your children do likewise.
Demand classes on American culture in the Mexican school system.
Demand a local Mexican driver license. This will afford other legal rights and will go far to legitimize your unauthorized, illegal, presence in Mexico.
Insist that local Mexican law enforcement teach English to all its officers.
Good luck! You'll be demanding for the rest of time or soon dead. Because it will never happen.
It will not happen in Mexico or any other country in the world... Except right here. Land of the naive.
God Bless America--She needs it.
Also, the SSA has had for years a suspense file of annual earnings (W-2) data (by employer ID, by employee SSN) that contains phony SSNs and SSNs that are real but don't match the person in the master files at SSA. We know who they are. There goes the too expensive ("tons of money") argument that you made.
The 1986 Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA) specifies to the employer who may be hired: "U.S. citizens, U.S. nationals, and the following classes of aliens with work authorization: permanent residents, temporary residents (that is, individuals who have gone through the legalization program), refugees, and asylees."
As long as the documents presented to the employer proving legal status "are allowed by law and appear to be genuine on their face and to relate to the person, they should be accepted. Not to do so is illegal."
OK. What's the poor employer to do? You see, all those counterfeit identification documents available out there "appear to be genuine on their face and [do] relate to the person." End of problems for the employer.
At most the employer would have to fire the employee if the employer is notified that the employee is judged by the INS to be working illegally.
Where employers knowing hire ILLEGALs and get caught: "According to the INS, employers are routinely given the opportunity to negotiate a settlement of the fine levied against them, and most often ('99.5% of the time') they do so." In cases of "sweat shops" many just close up and disappear.
http://www.fairus.org/ImmigrationIssueCenters/ImmigrationIssueCenters.cfm?ID=1188&c=13
This link contains a description of the failed enforcement of the 1986 "reform" and how it wound up causing a flood of ILLEGAL immigrants and virtually permitted employers to hire ILLEGALs. There is also a description of the lame efforts by Congress and the administration to "get the counterfeit paperwork stopped."
Now, this month -- December, 2004 -- there is suppose to be the implementation of an online Social Security Number Verification System (SSNVS) available to all employers. Will it be used? Will an Administration finally enforce the eighteen-year-old "reform"? Fat chance. Diito the chances of enforcing the "guest worker" plan, IMO.
OH and we set up permanent residence, Right!!!
These people are not tourists they are illegal invaders. And I think it rude that they come here and demand medical care and education at my expense. Don't you?
Been to California lately? Sorry they already took California!!!
The silent war being waged by Mexico, for many years now, is a far-greater threat to America and its continued existence as a sovereign nation than Iraq is. While we are over there, Mexico is over here setting up their Trojan Horse Consular Offices in every American city, infiltrating our institutions and otherwise asserting itself directly into our political process.
With over 2 million Mexicans entering America illegally every year on top of the 15 million plus that are already here (and another 20 mm Amnestied) Mexico is consolidating great political power in our institutions and government. With this power they now feel free to openly lobby our politicians and make outrageous demands and no one says anything. Just look at how our politicians jump their hoops and pander to Fox and his criminal associates everytime they visit the U.S.
Either we as a nation realize the real war, force political changes and address Mexico front and center or we cede large regions of America to Mexico and give the most corrupt, feudal state in the western world a seat of power in OUR government and live with the consequences.
It isn't just jobs --- pregnant girls and women are one very large group of illegal border crossers. All they need to do is make it over in time to give birth and they're set for life --- WIC, food stamps, housing subsidies, completely free health care and much much more. An illegal woman here has had 4 babies in 4 years --- unmarried of course and those 4 citizens children and future ones give her the live of a welfare queen.
"When you reward people for breaking the law, guess what is going to happen"
You get more of whatever you subsidize. Taxpayers are subsidizing cheap labor,medical, housing you name it for a few law breaking employers.
Really? I heard him on CNN last night saying he supports the senate bill...no immigration controls. We shall see. It would be nice to know for sure what he supports.
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