Lawmakers push Highlands building ban (MAJOR 800,000 NJ acre land-grab)

Star Ledger ^ | 3/30/04 | STEVE CHAMBERS

[Libloather]

Legislation introduced yesterday by state Sens. Bob Smith (D- Middlesex) and Robert Martin (R- Morris) would virtually ban development on important watershed lands in the northern Highlands.

The proposed law -- and an identical version sponsored by Assemblyman John McKeon (D- Essex) -- largely follows the recommendations of Gov. James E. McGreevey's Highlands Task Force.

[Libloather]

"This is one of the most far-reaching land-use bills ever introduced," said Jeff Tittel of the state Sierra Club chapter.

You can say that again...

[backhoe]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1114777/posts

NJ Governor Mgreevey In Secret Talks About Highlands, NJ Land Grab
April 9, 2004 | LaserLock

Anti-sprawl Agenda Renewed
The state government wants to TAKE 392,000 acres of land without public comment. Anybody surprised?

[Mel Gibson]

There was an individual who called in on Rush Limbaugh about this matter. As per Drudge states, developing....

These environmental wackos are amazing

[GailA]

btt, picked up and sent on to coordinator of Eagle Forum in TN, and talk radio host for Unraveling the New World Order, and Nashville and Memphis talk radio host.

[Libertarianize the GOP]

ping

[XRdsRev]

While I am not for or against this proposal until I hear the details, I do live in Central New Jersey and have friends and relatives in the Highlands region.

While the proposal sounds excessive (and maybe it is), many New Jerseyans realize that this area is very threatened by development. The highlands is largely made up of mountains, forests, lakes, streams and resivoirs. There are small towns and villages interspersed through parts of the region but no big towns or cities. Most of the roads are small 2 laners not suitable to heavy traffic.

Development in that portion of New Jersey would require large investments in infrastructure improvements which would have to be paid for by the taxpayers of New Jersey. From roadway improvements/new construction to sewage and water treatment facilities. The developers never mention these taxpayer costs when they argue about the "need" to develop.

Careless development has raped large portions of Central New Jersey and cost taxpayers Billions of $$$$ in unforseen costs. Developers (especially the larger ones) have lined their pockets and left tremendous problems in their wake. Developers have few friends in New Jersey anymore among liberals and conservatives alike. The development industry has continually lied, misrepresented and manipulated their way along for the last 20 years. Now many of them have adopted the tactic of suing municipalities to change zoning laws so that bigger and denser developments can be built in rural areas. People are pretty fed up with them.

One of the major issues for New Jerseyans, if not the major state issue, is overdevelopment. I cannot overstate the problems it has caused, from skyrocketing property taxes, flooding, garbage, declining water quality, destruction of hunting habitat, horrendous traffic etc. etc.

The tax benefits that were promised by many developers, never materialized and many municipalities have figured out that every house or condo built, actually ends up costing the taxpayers more than they bring in from taxes and fees.

I am no fan of McGreevy, I didn't vote for him last election and won't in the next one either but if Republicans take the side of Developers in New Jersey, they are going to never regain the State House or the Legislature. New Jersey and overdevelopment are NOT perfect together anymore.

[farmfriend]

Rights, farms, environment ping.
Let me know if you wish to be added or removed from this list.
I don't get offended if you want to be removed.

[E.G.C.]

BTTT!!!!!!

[hedgetrimmer]

Just so you know, regional plans are unconstitutional and they are trying to create one to control the watershed.

When you allow the government to control the watershed, you are eliminating rights to private property, because they will use the watershed as a means to deprive you of your right to use property, and your ability to own it.

Because its not your property in danger of legislated confiscation, you have a tendency to think that protecting the "environment" is more important than private property, since someone else is going to take the hit for protecting the environment for you.

The government is supposed to protect individual liberty and private property rights above everything else. If you allow them to confiscate this property in the name of the "collective" the people of New Jersey who are naive enough to believe that the government controlling land use is a good thing, then you support collective government, not our constitutional republic.

Collective governments throughout history have had a miserable record of "protecting the enviroment" the environmental degradation of Poland and other eastern european countries under a collective, communist government was astounding.

You should fight regionalisation with every breath because it is only a means to collectivize and remove your constitutional rights from you and everyone else in your state.

[XRdsRev]

Look you can argue all you want about "Constitutional Rights" and while I normally would agree with you, this situation is quite a bit different.

What we are talking about here is a plan that would stop large developments in the Highlands Region. Small developments in properly zoned areas would still be allowed.

You want to talk about rights ?? How about my rights to keep my property in the way I bought it ? For 30 years I lived on property that never flooded. Now that huge developments have gone in on the watershed all around me, my land floods everytime we have a decent rain.

What about my rights ?? What about my rights to live in a Township where the rate of government services stays stable or shrinks... Now that we have 10,000 new residents in the last 10 years, we need more roads, more police, bigger schools....who pays for this ?? The Taxpayer, mostly people who have lived here most of their lives, who now have to foot the bill for big development projects we never wanted and never needed. Two years ago the County took a 15 foot right of way off my land to widen the road because now there are too many cars heading to and from those big developments and shopping centers.

How about my rights. How about my right to live in a community that isn't sued every year by another big developer who bought zoned land and now decides that are going to bankrupt the town if we don't allow them to build what they want, zoning or no zoning.

How about my neighbors rights to farm his land ? His farm has been in his family for 4 generations but now is at risk because of high local property (school) taxes and the complaints from people who live in the big new development next to him "that his machinery is loud and the fertilizer smells".

Everybody has rights but those rights come with responsibilities. I own land, it's my land but I also realize I can't put a chemical dump on it just because I want to. In a world where everyone was isolated and no cause had an effect, then absolute private property rights would make sense. We don't live in that world. If you or I are doing something on our property that screws over other people, then it becomes their business. The constitutional rights of huge land speculators/developers like Hovnanian and Toll Brothers don't outweigh tose of the rest of us. If they had built in a responsible manner, people would have welcomed them with open arms but they did not. They have no constitutional right to speculate on land and expect taxpayers to foot the bills for their huge development projects.

Big developments in the Highlands have the potential to screw over hundreds of thousands of New Jerseyans. I am not a fan of regional planning but in the state we live in today, with the development pressures we face, it seems to be the only system that makes sense. Local planning and zoning boards have become almost helpless to stop development they do not want and cannot afford. The only way to fight it is for communities to be grouped together in a regional structure. I don't know if the Highlands legislation is the answer, I have only read parts of the plan but something has to be done to control the development here that has gone beyond reasonable into the realm of "build as much as you can on every square foot of land and f*ck everyone else".

[hedgetrimmer]

Regionalism is not the answer. If your property has been harmed by developments near you, you have the right to sue and to protect your property. The answer is not unelected bureaucrats in a phony regional government.

I live in an area that was taken over by so-called phony regional governments and committees and believe me, the Constitution is the only thing that is going to protect your rights. IF your constitutional rights had been valued and protected your attendence at the town meetings about zoning changes or whatever was going on in the community should have protected you. But because the regionalists bypass constitutional government and enact regulations that people take for laws, they get away with murder.

Absolute private property rights are the basis of freedom. You cannot give away _one_ stick in the property rights bundle without having the potential for all of them being taken away.

In my county we have had regional governments and committees for years. They are squeezing everyone out of the rural areas to protect the red legged frog and the water shed. The only housing they are permitting to be built is high density, mixed use. People thought they were going to keep their open space with the regional committees deciding everything for them. Well guess what, no one can afford to build anymore because the permits cost too much and land is too high because it is all being taken out of private hands and put into the "public" domain.

When you say you think the only thing to do is to support regional government you are throwing away everyone's constitutional rights. And you know not what you do, because soon after you give up your rights, worse things are going to happen to your area.

We have a proposal on the table that would penalize farmers in our area if rainwater runs off their land into the watershed. Yes, perfectly natural rainwater is considered a pollutant when it runs into the watershed. Do you know what that is going to do to property ownership and farming in our area? Can you guess? Can you guess who dreamed up the idea to penalize people who have rainwater running off their property? Watch out you are asking for disaster.

[Coleus]

http://www.highlandscoalition.org/
http://www.savethehighlands.org/
http://www.nynjtc.org/issues/2001/highlands.html
http://www.fs.fed.us/na/durham/ima/news/2003/text/03_highland.shtml

[hedgetrimmer]

Wow. Planners and managers, creating a crisis to frighten the people into giving up their rights for a phony open space project. What do you think, shortly after they get their way, they won't allow humans on it at all, unless of course you're a planner or manager or a member of their family. And for the poster worried about his taxes right now, what happens to his taxes when
$80,000 acres are taken out of the hands of the taxpaying public and into the hands of unelected often socialist bureaucrats? Anyone want to take a guess?

Here's an intersting link:

The true barriers of our liberty in this country",
wrote Mr. Jefferson,

"are our state governments, and the wisest conservative power ever contrived by man is that of which our Revolution and present government found us possessed. Distinct states, amalgamated into one as to their foreign concerns, but single and independent as to their internal administration."

It is as to matters within each state's boundaries that the state is, and remains, sovereign; but there is an intrusion into the rights of the peoples of our several states to govern themselves that is represented by efforts at regional government.


http://www.sweetliberty.org/issues/regionalism/horton.htm

[forester]

Look you can argue all you want about "Constitutional Rights" and while I normally would agree with you, this situation is quite a bit different.

What we are talking about here is a plan that would stop large developments in the Highlands Region. Small developments in properly zoned areas would still be allowed.

In regards to the assertion that your situation is different, I note in the following quote from the text many similarities to what has been implimented in our area (They are in bold print)

The council will have dramatic impact in the long run, but the bill also calls for immediate action in the form of sweeping new regulatory powers by the state Department of Environmental Protection.

DEP would be given the right of first refusal on all property sales in the core, and all development on more than one acre would require a special Highlands permit.

The permitting process would ban development on steep slopes, within 300 feet of all streams and upland forests. It would tighten restrictions on water withdrawals, septic tank installations and "impervious" cover.

You bring up some very good points XRdsRev, but I agree with hedgetrimmer, massive government intervention is an awfully dangerous way to address these issues.

FWIW, these comments are only meant as a warning. Here is a related thread discussing the same issues for others who did not catch it: Interior Department Seeks Legislation for Establishing a National Heritage Area Program

[sergeantdave]

Quite simply, we are dealing with fascists in government. For the government to move onto private property and steal it is beyond unacceptable. As far as I can see, property owners will not be paid one thin dime for carrying out government's demands that their property be designated de-facto government nature preserves. And I'm sure the Marxists in black robes will see nothing wrong with the state stealing private land.

[XRdsRev]

I don't disagree with you and as I inferred in an earlier post, I don't view regionalization as the optimum solution but lassaiz faire has not worked in the past and would lead to disaster in the near future.

It has become a situation where government and big developers have been battling head to head with the taxpayer in the middle. I don't know how familiar you are with New Jersey and the problems that overdevelopment have caused. I guess you really have to live here to understand. I hate to say this but sometimes Constitutional arguments are wonderful theory but crummy reality.

We can debate all day about the absolute right of private property but lets be realistic, that has never really existed. Even in the first years of our nation, there were regulatory policies regarding private property. From taxation, to fence laws, to dam restrictions, to bans on producing alcohol, owning selling or transporting slaves, building mills furnaces or saloons, gambling, etc. etc. Private property has in many cases never really been private in the US.

Development is a very sensitive issue since it directly and indirectly affects many people who have no overt stake in the development itself. In the Highlands especially, there is a major concern about drinking water supplies and resivoirs which serve millions of people in and out of the region itself.

Big developers have made an art form of blackmailing and extorting small communities into granting development rights for "bad" projects. No big developer proposes a 50 unit development here anymore, everything is 300-400-600-1200 units. These developers have been speculating on land in the Highlands for years and lobbying Trenton to complete taxpayer funded transporation improvements to raise their development prospects. Everyone knows that once Rts. like 15 are fully completed, the developers are ready to start submitting building plans like crazy.

The only real mechanism for stopping this insanity is for the state to step in. I don't relish the idea but I also know that doing nothing is even worse.

P.S. most building on steep slopes is already difficult if impossible to get approved and it is very hard to get septic permits in many areas around the Highlands already (high water tables, clay soil, poor drainage).

P.S.S. just so you know, I have business interests in the construction & real estate trades so I definately do believe in and benefit from reasonable, smart development. Unfortunately much of the big development going on here now is not reasonable or smart.