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To: robowombat

I am intrigued by Jacob Hamblin’s account who owned a ranch at Mountain Meadows at the time of the massacre.

When asked who was most to blame .... he stated that it was ‘Buchanon’s Blunder’ which sent the US army to ‘subdue’ the Mormons, causing a panic. These same Mormons had been run from NY to Ohio to Missouri to Illinois and then to Utah from religeous persecution and were unwilling to run again.

Without ‘Buchanon’s Blunder’ there would have been no ‘Mountain Meadows Massacre’.


3 posted on 09/22/2019 4:12:26 PM PDT by teppe
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To: teppe

The Mormon’s flight to the Salt Lake valley resulted in the formation of the Mormon Battalion and an isolationist bunker mentality. That’s part of the reason but not justification for Mountain Meadows. Like the native Americans, the Mormons didn’t foresee the massive migration and colonization of the west and thought the geographic isolation was a permanent condition.


25 posted on 09/22/2019 5:03:00 PM PDT by Spok
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To: teppe; Elsie
teppe, you've reached a new low in your posting when you wrote, "Without ‘Buchanon’s Blunder’ there would have been no ‘Mountain Meadows Massacre’.

Nothing justifies the murder that occurred by morons.

Here is historical description of what occurred when mormons massacred men, women and children emigrants, merely traveling to California, then stripped and looted them...

"The plan was devious, but effective. Major John Higbee, in command of the forces at Mountain Meadows, persuaded John Lee and William Bateman to act as decoys to draw the emigrants out from the protection of their wagons. Lee and Bateman, carrying a white flag, marched across the field to the emigrants' camp. The desperate emigrants agreed to the terms promised by Lee: They would give up their arms, wagons, and cattle, in return for promise that they would not be harmed as they embarked on a 35-mile hike back to Cedar City. Samuel McMurdy, a member of the Nauvoo Legion, took the reigns of one of the wagons into which were loaded some of the youngest children. A woman and a few seriously injured emigrant men were loaded into a second wagon. John Lee positioned himself between the two wagons as they pulled out. Following the two wagons, the women and the older children of the Fancher party walked behind. After the wagons had moved on, Higbee ordered the emigrant men to begin walking in single file. An armed Mormon "guard" escorted each emigrant man.

"When the escorted men had fallen a quarter mile or so behind the women and children, who had just crested a small hill, Higbee yelled, "Halt! Do your duty!" Each of the Mormon men shot and killed the emigrant at his side. Meanwhile, on the other side of the hill, Nelphi Johnson shouted the order to begin the slaughter of the women and older children. Men rushed at the defenseless emigrants from both sides, and the killing went on amidst "hideous, demon-like yells."

Nancy Huff, four years old at the time of the massacre, later remembered the horror: "I saw my mother shot in the forehead and fall dead. The women and children screamed and clung together. Some of the young women begged the assassins after they run out on us not to kill them, but they had no mercy on them, clubbing their guns and beating out their brains." It was over in just a few minutes. 120 members of the Fancher party were dead. The youngest children, seventeen or eighteen in all, were gathered up, to later be placed in Mormon homes. None of the survivors were over seven years old.

The next day, Colonel Dame and Lt. Colonel Haight visited the site of the massacre with John Lee and Philip Klingensmith . Lee, in his confession, described the field on that day: "The bodies of men, women and children had been stripped entirely naked, making the scene one of the most loathsome and ghastly that can be imagined." Dame appeared shocked by what he found. "I did not think there were so many of them [women and children], or I would not have had anything to do with, Dame reportedly said. Haight, angered by Dame's remark, expressed concern that Dame might try to blame him for an action that Dame had ordered. The men agreed on one thing, however: Mormon participation in the massacre had to be kept secret. Within twenty-fours hours, Haight had another reason for concern. Brigham Young's reply to his inquiry arrived in Cedar City. "Too late, too late," Haight said as he read Young's letter and began to cry.

https://www.famous-trials.com/mountainmeadows/936-home

Disgusting.

32 posted on 09/22/2019 5:44:24 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: teppe

Bullshit!

They chose to murder innocents.

It was no one’s fault but their own evil choice.


52 posted on 09/22/2019 8:24:44 PM PDT by SoConPubbie (Mitt and Obama: They're the same poison, just a different potency)
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To: teppe
These same Mormons had been run from NY to Ohio to Missouri to Illinois and then to Utah from religeous persecution and were unwilling to run again.

I'd hate to call you a liar; so I won't; but the FACTS of this statement are plainly; at least; incorrect.

Many 'Mormons" were NOT run from Missouri. The fearful ones who CHOOSE to follow a false prophet to their deaths on the trek west to Utah, are the ones who RAN.

(A 'true' prophet would have at least WARNED them of the dangers of leaving ).

The ones who DID NOT LEAVE, became the owners of all of the land and possessions left behind.


Stop off in NAVUOO some day and see the history.



169 posted on 10/30/2019 3:38:07 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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