[CondoleezzaProtege]

French President Macron blamed nationalism during his speech in Paris today, but did he give due attention to his own country's abandonment of the Christian faith?

[PeterPrinciple]

French President Macron blamed nationalism during his speech in Paris today, but did he give due attention to his own country’s abandonment of the Christian faith?

---

Repeat LOUD and OFTEN...……………………….

[MeneMeneTekelUpharsin]

So, now are we beginning to see why the hand is writing on the wall? Finally?

[j.argese]

To take a note from Mssr Limbaugh, the ruination of mankind has as much to do with religion in the public square as does the eating of carrots. Taking out the menace of islam, Christian on Christian violence, between the various sects, occurred. Much violence between the various islamic sects. Hindu vs Buddhists. Need I go on?

As much as he may frighten us, we root for our own personal boogeyman to be the villain.

May I add my own? Mine would be the battle between individualism and statism. Makes more sense to me. NAZIs didn't stop at Jews. Russia at democracies. China didn't stop at ... well China never sleeps.

[Buttons12]

Religion didn’t stop the Ottomans from periodically massacring minorities.

[VanDeKoik]

The war started by TERRORISTS, and because of INTERNATIONAL TREATIES OF MUTUAL DEFENSE, it grew into a dumpster fire, where dissent was almost criminalized in part to protect the “honor” of the in-bred monarchs that people were told to fight in the name of.

[IronJack]

Theocratically-based regimes, notably the Russian and Ottoman empires, were replaced by secular ones.

I would not characterize the Russian regimes as ever being "theocratically based." The Ottomans, sure. They're Islamic. So it naturally follows.

But while the Church played a very important role in Russian society, Russia's rulers were no more theocrats than their counterparts in Prussia, Scandinavia, the Lowlands, or England. There, the leaders paid lip service to Christianity, but their actions in many cases belied their allegiance to biblical principles. Russia under the czars was no different.

[fso301]

Anyone who spent time in Europe traveling about and visiting historic sites would recognize that Europe never fully Christianized.

[Fhios]

Intellectual Dribble. Written by someone who likes to hear themselves think. Makes one wonder if the author has ever read Carl von Clausewitz or at least some of his more quotables: War is not an independent phenomenon, but the continuation of politics by different means.”

[aimhigh]

When the Russian Communists began persecuting the church, the average church attendance dropped from 300 to 15 - a 95% falling away.

[JoeFromSidney]

But for World War I, I might not be here. My paternal grandfather had been in the Italian Army during the Balkan Wars. He immigrated to the U.S., but his wife was homesick for Italy. They returned to Italy, leaving my father in the U.S. with an uncle. When World War I broke out, grandfather was recalled to duty, and killed on the Italian front. Dad was then raised by his uncle. Dad and Mother married in 1930. I was born in 1931. Had Dad returned to Italy with his father, he'd never have met my mother.

[JoeFromSidney]

But for World War I, I might not be here. My paternal grandfather had been in the Italian Army during the Balkan Wars. He immigrated to the U.S., but his wife was homesick for Italy. They returned to Italy, leaving my father in the U.S. with an uncle. When World War I broke out, grandfather was recalled to duty, and killed on the Italian front. Dad was then raised by his uncle. Dad and Mother married in 1930. I was born in 1931. Had Dad returned to Italy with his father, he'd never have met my mother.

[x]

Monarchs have always gone to war over power, wealth, and security. By 1914, decisions were made by elected or appointed ministers, but the reasons for going to war weren't so different. The people didn't have much to say about it, but they went to war because of patriotism or compulsion.

There was a sense that nationalism had replaced religion, but it's hard to figure out how true that was or whether that helped to cause the war. Elites were focused on worldly things as before. The poor had too little power and too many problems to be much of a force in politics. Some in the middle classes became fervent nationalists or materialists, but they were stepping into the shoes of the older elites.