i take it the tube must be dividable at the flange, else wise it'd be a real first class b!tch going around corners in transit
Posted on 03/30/2016 12:01:19 PM PDT by C19fan
I will let the experts speak for themselves. But if there is a way to do something, somebody will figure out how to get it done.
http://www.digitaltrends.com/cool-tech/zumwalt-destroyer-railgun/
http://thediplomat.com/2016/03/u-s-may-field-railgun-on-zumwalt-destroyer/
http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/a2289/4231461/
Luddite!
>> Ask the Wehrmacht what they thought of American artillery.
Besides having a lot of it, we were really good at FDC, fire direction control. When your forward controllers can bring in fires from your DivAty, the DivArty from the two adjacent divisions on either side, and corp level assets, you can really put a hurtin’ on a main force effort in your sector.
How about an AC-130 Gunship... That can increase your artillery range...by a lot.
Never heard a peep about either one since, must have been too effective or the right lobby was not involved.
Oh no! The dreaded Popular Mechanix article....
Uh, no - mechanical engineer with 40 plus years in artillery and fire support.
I have some experience with rail gins - do you?
Or are you just reading comic books?
I understand that we are using “smart” 155mm projectiles currently. The are not that expensive, I understand. I know that the project to develop fuses to make “dumb” projectiles “smart” was well along when I was supporting those tests.
We have had “base bleed” projectiles for many years.
This wikipedia article says that the Excaliber round (I put in a lot of hours on that project) is currently in use and the cost per round for production is $68,000, and the range is 25 miles.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M982_Excalibur
Here is a video of the Precision Guidance Kit (PGK) to make smart shells out of “dumb” standard rounds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ebzh12PR0-U
I worked on this project as well. A tremendous amount of testing at Yuma Proving Ground. It is *the* place for artillery testing in the DOD.
Yes! Here is the contract for production of the PGK!
The fuses run under 10K each. It has already been used in Afghanistan.
Thanks C19fan, for posting this. It is a great feeling to see that some of the many, many hours I put in on RDT&E is paying off.
Consider how few rounds you need, in comparison with the massive arty barrages in WWII, when you have this sort of accuracy at your fingertips.
“During this demonstration, PGK delivered 90 percent of rounds fired within five meters accuracy of the target positioned 27 kilometers from the gun position.”
It probably costs 10K just to get a plane off the ground, not to include the risk to pilot and the plane.
A simple “dumb” round costs about $500. So you can have 21 “dumb” rounds for 1 PGK. But that does not consider the costs of shipping those rounds, transporting them in a combat situation, and storing and guarding them.
Nor are you assured that 21 “dumb” rounds will achieve what you are likely to get with 1 PGK. You have to fire to see where the dumb rounds hit, then adjust them into the target, which gives the target time to react, disperse, get under cover, start counter battery fire...
The over all cost and effectiveness figures are all on the side of the PGK.
What frosted me about the establishment attack on Gerald Bull was that he showed a way that likely could have cut the cost of space exploration by 90%.
We could be putting supplies to the space station, and building materials with super-guns.
He already demonstrated sub-orbital capabilities.
I suspect NASA sabotaged his efforts, or more likely the State Department, because his guns did not fit into their stupid “arms control” games.
Bull was a full bore genius, and our insane government set him up and wasted a great man.
My dad was an artillery spotter in the 20th Armored, seeing combat in southern Germany. Lots of good stories, and he brought home a rock from Hitler's fireplace in Bertchesgaden. But my mom never let him make a lamp out of the 155 casing he brought back. I did get to shoot his liberated Mauser rifle, though.
Good stuff. I wish I still had the demilled 37mm round that kicked around the household goods when I was a kid. I suspect it came from one of the great uncles who served in WWII. One fly into Normandy in a glider with a 75mm pack howitzer. Those guys didn’t get jump pay like the rest of the guys in the 101st; they deserved it, those gliders were no picnic.
/fly/flew/
While I agree with you that precision is where we need to be, there are instances where mass is critical too: area fires (such as prep fires), fires where you don’t know exactly where the enemy if concealed, final protective fires, etc.
I think that you are being a bit more optomistic about PGM prices; Excalibur had a price closer to $250K each last I heard.
Lastly, improvements in on-carriage fire control, aiming using Ring Laser Gyros, improved MET, etc., has given ordinary tube artillery much greater first- round precision. We got first-round CEPs around 15m with our XM-326 system at Yuma a few years ago.
By the way - while you were at YPG, did you see the HARP gun out there? I was amazed to see that monster sitting by its lonesome no that far from the range gate.
I spent over 9 years in Germany during the Cold War (Infantryman). I came to know a number of former members of the WWII German military. They were terrified of American artillery, much more so than the Russians who had more, but who did not have the American fire control system. The spotter was the lynchpin in the system. They saved my rear end on many occasions in my days in Southeast Asia.
250k is the price of a round with the amortized development costs. The 68K price is the cost of production at the time the article was written.
The 182K per projectile price has all been spent, and will only go down as more projectiles are produced.
The PGK price was quoted from the article about the current contract. It makes sense. The PGK is just a smart fuse that you screw into a “dumb” round.
You are right that sometimes, you need area fires. I probably should have mentioned it. But the big saving for smart rounds is the logistics that you free from having to transport, store and guard hundreds of thousands of artillery rounds, and the lesser number of batteries and guns that you need.
How long before we get “smart” 81mm mortars?
As for the HARP gun, I drove by it many, many times. It always angered me that we had treated Gerald Bull so badly.
He should have been an honored American hero, instead of being assassinated by Israeli agents when he was working for Sadam while we were still allies with Iraq, before the First Gulf War when Sadam invaded Kuwait.
What a waste.
Spotters favor heights for enhanced visibility. My dad was spotting in a forward position in a Jeep with a green second looey who allowed them to be silhouetted against the skyline. A German 88 crew took note and greeted them with a shot that exploded yards away, and my dad delighted in reporting that foolish looey crapped his pants, on his way to becoming battle-wise.
As the Germans retreated, they left equipment behind like every retreating army. My dad “captured” a railroad train which included an entire carload of Mausers. Of course his unit moved on, so he could keep only the one.
i take it the tube must be dividable at the flange, else wise it'd be a real first class b!tch going around corners in transit
i guess not! good luck with that
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