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A Review of The Southern Cross - The Story of the Confederacy's First Battle Flag
The Washington Times ^ | 22 October 2013 | Richard G. Williams, Jr.

Posted on 10/26/2013 7:01:38 AM PDT by Davy Buck

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To: central_va

Yeah, frankly it’s hard to find a photo of any woman from that period that anyone today would consider a looker.


81 posted on 10/28/2013 11:15:51 AM PDT by Bubba Ho-Tep ("More weight!"--Giles Corey)
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To: Bubba Ho-Tep
Mrs Custer:


82 posted on 10/28/2013 11:16:40 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va
Funny, I was just about to post this one of Mrs. Custer. We may have a winner in the Miss Civil War General's Wife Pageant.


83 posted on 10/28/2013 11:22:30 AM PDT by Bubba Ho-Tep ("More weight!"--Giles Corey)
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To: Bubba Ho-Tep

I would say Mrs. Custer is winning.


84 posted on 10/28/2013 11:28:49 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: PeaRidge

That’s not an ad-hom.


85 posted on 10/28/2013 12:54:11 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: rockrr
Let's see what you think:

Ad Hominem: An argument based on the perceived failings of an adversary rather than on the merits of the case; a logical fallacy that involves a personal attack.

Although some faulty arguers may call attention to distasteful features of their opponents’ subject in order to manipulate the responses of their audience, most abusers apparently believe that such characteristics actually provide good reasons for ignoring or discrediting the arguments of those who have them. Logically, of course, the fact that any of these characteristics might fit an opponent provides no reason to ignore or discredit his or her arguments or criticisms.
(T. E. Damer, Attacking Faulty Reasoning. Wadsworth, 2001)

That is why you have always been contemptuous and do not realize that you are...your biases lie outside your consciousness. Does it occur to you why it is so easy for you to adopt the smugness that is on display here.

86 posted on 10/28/2013 1:38:53 PM PDT by PeaRidge
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To: central_va

She looks pretty good... compare her to the wookie!


87 posted on 10/28/2013 1:44:17 PM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!)
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To: central_va

It’s amazing what even a hint of a smile will do.


88 posted on 10/28/2013 3:05:10 PM PDT by Bubba Ho-Tep ("More weight!"--Giles Corey)
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To: RWGinger

But if there had not been slaves, there would have been no South.

At the time, agriculture on a large scale was being done by slaves and the south was an agrarian society.

Planting and harvesting was labor intensive work.

FYI, by many standards slavery still exists around the world. There are places where large factories dominate and if you work for them they provide you with food and housing and little else. Should you try to leave and go to work elsewhere you will find your options very limited.

While American slavery was a detestable institution, it was also a product of it’s times - born of necessity and perpetuated by heinous economic exploitation of the industrial north.


89 posted on 10/28/2013 3:19:53 PM PDT by Crusher138 ("Then conquer we must, for our cause it is just")
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To: PeaRidge
That is why you have always been contemptuous and do not realize that you are...your biases lie outside your consciousness. Does it occur to you why it is so easy for you to adopt the smugness that is on display here.

Too funny. You project without perception. You literally are what you accuse.

90 posted on 10/28/2013 3:54:08 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: Crusher138
At the time, agriculture on a large scale was being done by slaves and the south was an agrarian society.

So was the Midwest, but somehow they managed to plant and harvest without slaves.

91 posted on 10/28/2013 3:55:31 PM PDT by Bubba Ho-Tep ("More weight!"--Giles Corey)
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To: Crusher138
But if there had not been slaves, there would have been no South.

Gee wiz, no white person ever planted a crop, sawed an board or laid a brick in the antebellum South. Who knew?

92 posted on 10/28/2013 4:22:00 PM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Bubba Ho-Tep
<So was the Midwest, but somehow they managed to plant and harvest without slaves. /I>

There are high-labor crops, there are low-labor crops.

Indigo, tobacco, cotton are examples of the former; grain crops in general constitute the latter -- while animal forage requires even less labor.

As a rule, the former are better suited to the climatic and soil conditions in the south, while the latter were ideally suited to the Midwest.

In other words, the agricultural Midwest didn't necessarily conscientiously choose to avoid slavery; instead, there was no economic need for it.

93 posted on 10/28/2013 4:22:42 PM PDT by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: Ignorance On Parade)
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To: Crusher138
While American slavery was a detestable institution, it was also a product of it’s times - born of necessity and perpetuated by heinous economic exploitation of the industrial north

You should have quit while you were ahead.

Born of expedience and perpetuated by heinous economic exploitation of the black man by arrogant southern opportunists.

Fixed it for ya in the interest of accuracy.

94 posted on 10/28/2013 4:26:45 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: okie01
So what you're trying to claim is that the south had no choice but to resort to slave labor? That if there had been no slave trade, the south would have been a howling wasteland? Because I'm pretty sure there were farmers in the south who didn't use slaves. Hell, most of the Lost Causers on these threads go to great pains to tell us that their ancestors didn't have slaves. So clearly it's possible to have an agricultural economy in the south without slave labor.

No, the truth is that the southern planter class chose to maximize their profits by planting labor intensive crops, then using slaves to tend them.

95 posted on 10/28/2013 5:32:24 PM PDT by Bubba Ho-Tep ("More weight!"--Giles Corey)
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To: Bubba Ho-Tep
So what you're trying to claim is that the south had no choice but to resort to slave labor?

Did I say that? Gee, I thought I said there were high labor crops and low labor crops.

And, that since low labor crops were best adapted to the Midwest, there was no particular credit to be assigned for not employing slaves.

You are reading into what I wrote something that isn't there -- a sign of over-zealousness.

I might add, though, that the South had a slave-based economy because that is a choice that the British financiers had imposed upon them at the time of initial settlement.

The stock companies which developed the southern colonies sought crops that could be profitably grown in the climate and soils of the area. The initial winner was indigo, a crop that thrived in the hot, humid lowlands of the Carolinas.

But it was also a labor-intensive crop -- which, in turn, gave birth to the slave trade thru Charleston. Had it thrived in the rocky soils of New England, there would've been a slave trade thru the port of Boston, as well.

Personally, I find it very difficult to criticize anybody of the mid-19th century for decisions regarding economic systems that were created in the mid-17th century. The system was a product of another era -- when slavery was viewed in a totally different light. <

Times change. Standards change. Slavery is now a thing of the past...and that's good. But I'm not going to blame anybody who inherited the system, when it was still legal (and Constitutional, I might add), for defending it and their livelihood. Misguided, perhaps. But malicious, no.

If you insist on carrying the torch for racial injustice, why don't you focus on the people who created and practiced Jim Crow. From the outset, they knew they were doing something that was inherently wrong. And they were doing it for primarily political reasons.

Plessy vs Ferguson was far more pernicious than the sanctioning of slavery in the Constitution and the so-called 3/5 rule.

96 posted on 10/28/2013 6:08:28 PM PDT by okie01 (The Mainstream Media: Ignorance On Parade)
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To: PeaRidge

I suspect the artillery bombardment of Fort Sumter would qualify as an act of aggression. Not that much different than a bomb or torpedo falling on Pearl Harbor. A premeditated attack against a United States military installation. Doesn’t make much difference if the people firing are Japanese or ex U.S. citizens.


97 posted on 10/28/2013 6:21:24 PM PDT by X Fretensis
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To: LibLieSlayer

I’m sure you meant descendent.


98 posted on 10/28/2013 6:29:02 PM PDT by rabidralph
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To: rabidralph

Yes I did and thank you very much.


99 posted on 10/29/2013 4:11:37 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!)
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To: rockrr

Name a major agrarian economy of the early to mid 19th century that did not use slaves.

If you do not think that the tariffs imposed by the north and their manipulation of prices did not de facto promote slavery, then you are a deluded fool.


100 posted on 10/29/2013 5:52:08 AM PDT by Crusher138 ("Then conquer we must, for our cause it is just")
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