[West Texas Chuck]

I have my eye on a Springfield SOCOM-16. I like the way it looks, and I think I can learn how to operate and own an M1A style weapon. Don't know for sure how my old broke down shoulder will handle the recoil of a .308 but I like the cut of that thing's jib. I'm good with iron sights, for a start anyway.

What say you FReepers.

[West Texas Chuck]

At the moment, this is my Kim Kardashian:

http://www.springfield-armory.com/armory.php?version=35

I am open to criticisms, advice, insults, or guidance.

[expat1000]

I was going to reminisce about M14s but that piece looks sweet! 8.8 lbs should eat up a lot of the recoil, not that .308 is that bad anyway (I will be called a wimp here for sure for saying it has any recoil at all!)

[FromTheSidelines]

You want a compact 308? There's really only one option: the Kel Tec RFB (bullpup configuration):

Magazine fed 308, spent brass comes out the front so you can fire from either right or left shoulder, has an 18.1" long barrel and 26.1" overall length (both just barely legal), and is one sweet firing rifle. I've got to shoot one, twice, for several magazines. VERY well balanced with the bulk of the weight centered between your fore hand and the shoulder, and it literally centers on the pistol grip - perfectly centered mass there.

I'm saving up for one - I think it's about the best option for a 308 out there, save something needed for serious target shooting. I was putting together 2-3 MOA groups in my first magazine, and tightened up to 1.5 to 2 MOA on my second (4X scope was mounted). Plenty accurate for anything I'd ever need it for.

Besides, having such a compact rifle would be great when out hunting in thick underbrush - no more trying to handle a 42" long rifle!

[Monitor]

There’s nothing like reaching out and touching something at 600+ yards. When you have to get in your car to drive to your target, you know it’s long range.

I have a Remington 700 PSS chambered in .308 with a Leupold LR-M3 3.5-10x40mm scope with mil-dots and side-focus. It’s my 300+ yard gun. Anything inside 300 yards is reserved for my AR-15.

If I didn’t already have the AR-15, I’d get a SOCOM for that job.

[USNBandit]

I bought a SOCOM 16 and was thoroughly disgusted with it. It functions fine, but it doesn't group, it patterns. Unless you are using national match ammo, it shoots 5 inch patterns at 100 yds. I sent it back, they recrowned the barrel, fired a barely 3" group off a machine rest with Federal National Match 168 gr. and sent it back to me saying it now met their specifications.

Maybe 16 inches is too short for that round with the twist of the barrel? All I know is that I could have spent a third less money and bought an AR or maybe even one of the .308 AR variants and gotten a better shooting gun.

I carry an M-4 for work and even my of the rack M-4 with a 16 inch barrel and an EOTech (a damn CQB sight) shoots better unsupported than that SOCOM off a bench.

My recommendation would be to maybe look for a guy that is down on his luck and wants to unload a lightly used rifle that you can try out. Go at least 18 inches on the M1A. The Navy got away with cutting down their barrels when they put them in the Sage stocks, but I think they went to 20". Not sure on that.

I also just got to shoot a 16 inch SCAR in .308 and mama mia was that nice. The one I shot had a fairly high end ELCAN sight on it which was pretty sweet. Things I like about it is that the controls are ambidextrous, and very M-4/AR familiar, good rails, conventional gas system, folding stock is nice for getting out of a vehicle/aircraft, an the thing was a tack driver. Not so good, after using an M-4 for so many years having a moving operating handle is a bit annoying, especially when it is flying around on the left side of the gun. If I got one I would switch it to the other side. That is a standard feature and can be done in a minute with the same part. Another challenge which you have to expect with all .308s is that full auto is like Mr. Toad's Wild Ride. Not big on full auto myself, but short bursts are a must. Not sure if it would be much easier with a forward grip installed or not. That takes most of the skill requirement out with an M-4. You definitely can't square up on the target and let lose with a burst.

[Jonty30]

I say, go big or go home.

http://jonmackin.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/home_made_bazooka2.jpg

[RC one]

I have an Armalite AR-10T. I want the carbine version. Magazines are pricey. That's the only drawback. The HK91 is nice but it tears up your brass and; therefore, sucks for reloading which is a big problem IMO. The FN-FAL is fantastic but not as accurate as the Armalite and not as familiar to someone like me who was trained by the army on an M16 platform. The M1A is nice and capable of great accuracy. I was torn between the AR10 and the M1A. I opted for the Armalite because of the familiarity, accuracy, and the versatility. Mounting accessories to it is a breeze as well which is nice.

[Yosemitest]

How much do you plan to spend?

I bought an Amralite AR-10A2 CARBINE 7.62 W FORWARD ASSIST BLACK for around $1500.00 over a year ago.



I wished now that I had bought the AR-30 .308 WINCHESTER 26" BBL for about $100.00 more at that time, but now cost $2,021.00



If money was no consideration, I'd buy the Nemesis Arms, truly unique multi-caliber custom rifle, the Vanquish Multi-Caliber - $4450.00 USD for it's break-down concealment ability.

[Arlis]

Get the AK first, then the Socom. AK’s = incredibly reliable, great short-mid range, enough power to knock em down good.

Socom = more distance, more power, more accuracy.

Odds are your needs are going to be closer up rather than farther away......

Of course, this is just my opinion....... :-)

[bushpilot1]

Fired a .306 Savage bolt action when I was 8 years old..Oh man..

[bushpilot1]

Fired a .308 Savage bolt action when I was 8 years old..Oh man..

[NoLibZone]

Bump for gun porn.

[NoLibZone]

How about one of these?

I have never shot one.

[semaj]

FN-FAL, not very short, but very reliable and accurate.

[Rashputin]

The first .308 I'd get would be a good bolt gun with a good scope and if you really want semi-auto, get and M1 Garand chambered for .308. If you have a problem with recoil, and some people do for one reason or another, get an M1 Garand chambered for .243. You can't go wrong having a Garand when you need something reliable.

For a second semi-auto, I'd love to have a Kal Tec RFB bullpup but the only person I know who has tried one is a gunsmith and said it had a very uneven trigger that broke a bit different round to round. He didn't know whether that could be straightened out with an adjustment or if it was intrinsic to the rifle. It may be intrinsic to the bullpup design since I heard the same thing from a couple of Brits about their bullpup years ago. I wish I could afford something along those lines, though, it would be a lot easier to handle and it does have a magazine rather than a clip.

JMHO

[Spktyr]

Look hard at the Kel-Tec RFB bullpup. Can have a long barrel but in a short package sized like a conventional carbine. Takes metric FAL mags. This one has an 18” barrel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9Xqa2vwq60

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNoUt3aVrus

[chuckles]

Buying a gun is a personal thing. There are 1000 arguments here on FR about the .30 cal vs .223. I'm 60 years old and was in the Army Guard and Air Guard. I had to qualify with both an M14 and M16 at the time. For me, emphasis added, The M14 was a real weapon and the M16 was a toy. It was fun to shoot, but if my life depended on it, the M14 was what I wanted to carry. As you know, the M16 won out and I was forced to use the 16 as my duty weapon. I've heard all the arguments over weight, and tumbling bullets and all the other crap that people use to justify the M16 over a real gun. When I got out, I saved my money and bought a Springfield M1A and still have it in the safe. I have an unnatural attachment to it emotionally because that is what I feel in my soul. I have 2 Ruger ranch rifles in .223 for plinking, and my wife and daughter use them proficiently. For me, it's just not the same. I have a similar feeling for my M1 Garand in 30.06 and my Ruger 77 in 30.06. It's the power and penetration vs a pop gun.

The "hackles" of Freepers are rising and the flames are coming, but like I said, it a personal thing with the buyer of said guns. I don't mean to insult a gun, but it's just the reality you find when you want to bring down a game animal or blast a tree, or shoot through an engine block. A .223 does fine for a human or a paper target, but if I want to kill something larger than a dog, I grab the .308. I hand load everything from 110 grn to 220 grn in 30 cal, but only have 3, maybe 4 choices in .223 ranging from prairie dogs to white tail. If you have the choice of hunting white tail, would you really choose the .223 over almost any .30 cal? I have a 30-30 and 2 AK 47's I would pick up before the .223. It's just me, I guess. As I think about it more, I would pick my TC 30-30, .357 Maximum, .44 mag, and TC .35 Remington, before I picked the Ranch Rifle. All my Thompson Center pistols are 14 inch and scoped except the .357 Maximum. I have a .223 TC in 14 inch, but in my mind its still a pop gun used for plinking. It's fun and I like to shoot it, but I just don't think of it as a serious hunting pistol.

As far as your shoulder goes, I can't imagine an M1A hurting unless you have arthritis or something. One concern I would have is the short barrel. Maybe it's penis envy, but I like longer barrels. Longer barrels burn more powder unless you load your own. If you use faster powder, you could compensate for the shorter barrel, but why bother for a few ounces of weight. If you want to hide it under your coat, well that again is a personal thing. A 16 inch barrel, vs a 24 inch barrel is a big speed difference and accuracy difference depending on how much powder burns in front of the barrel. Some sort of Bull Pup configuration may make the difference there.

IMO, if you are drawn to the M1A style weapon, you will always want one and nothing else will satisfy you till you get it. If you get it and want to buy another weapon, then get a .223. You can then decide, and if needed, pick one to sell. I bet the .223 goes down the road. If you love guns, the larger calibers are what you want. Look in the mirror and say out loud, " I don't want a .50 cal BMG". I bet you choke and your voice breaks. If not,........get the .223 cause you really don't like guns.

[Spktyr]

Also: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBGKi0OTDb8&NR=1

[Joe Boucher]

Cetma,
Nice H.K. knockoff .308
fairly inexpensive, accurate and what a whollop.

[eartick]

Like the M1A for several reasons, main reason it will shoot anything you load into the mag. Had way too many problems with other people’s AR10 platforms on being picky on what it would shoot.

The SOCCOM 16, for me, was a disappointment and a bigger disappointment for my brother who I talked into buying. What a mistake. Front heavy and feels off balance in CQB drills and forget about anything over 300 yards. Great at raising the dust in front of the target.

My M1A NM can ring 500 yard 12” plates all day long with the peep and a rest. I have had both shoulders worked on and never had a problem with too much kick from the .308

But like stated earlier in other posts, you have a personal choice to make. Good luck