Posted on 03/05/2022 10:18:32 AM PST by wardaddy
WaPo Uses Photo of John McCain Next to Nazi to Praise His ‘Human Rights’ Work
https://fair.org/home/john-mccain-human-rights-ukrainian-nazi-photo-washington-post/
You think I am 20? I actually studied history. What issue do you have with me?
Bkmk
Yep, nothing says "denazification" like invading and trying to kill the Jewish president of a neighboring country. For those who don't know, President Zelensky is Jewish, and his grandfather fought for the Red Army against the Nazis in WW2. The Nazis killed all of his grandfather's brothers, and annihilated the village where his grandmother was from.
Putin's claim that his attack is about stopping Nazis is ridiculous. It is right up there with claims that Justice Thomas is a white supremacist.
You know FR tradition is not to read the article at all 😀
Where have you been for 8 years when Ukraine was killing 14,000 people in Donbas? This conflict didn’t start two weeks ago.
Genocide is awful now matter who is perpetrating it, but after close to 10 million Ukrainians were murdered by Russian communists it is not surprising that some Ukrainians temporarily allied themselves with the Nazi invaders to repel the Russians.
Sadly the Russian revolution, Stalin, and WW2 resulted in millions of dead people in Ukraine as Ukrainians fought Russians, Germans, and other Ukrainians, and were subject to genocide from both the Russians and the Germans.
Hearing the Russians talk about anti-Semitism as something they are trying to end is ridiculous. They persecuted and imprisoned Jews for years, and Putin's KGB was at the heart of that effort.
What are your sources for this 14,000 number? Give the links. Or, if not on the net, give the citations.
I have been following what actually happened instead of drinking the Kool-aid poured by Putin's propaganda officers.
The separatists in the Donbass region launched a war against the country they were trying to secede from in 2014. The Russians joined them in fighting against the Ukrainian government. They reached a cease fire in the fall of 2014. Both sides have exchanged fire across the cease fire line since then.
According to published sources the actual number of civilians killed in that fighting is nowhere close to 14,000.
In response to a request from Radio Svoboda , the Office of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights counted the total number of victims of hostilities in Donbas from April 14, 2014 to February 10, 2020.Source - translated by Google."According to UNHCR estimates, the total number of casualties related to the conflict in Ukraine (from 14 April 2014 to 31 January 2021) is 42,000-44,000: 13,100-13300 dead (at least 3375 civilians, approximately 4150 Ukrainian military and approximately 5,700 members of armed groups); and 29,500-33500 wounded (7000-9000 civilians, 9700-10700 Ukrainian military and 12700-13700 members of armed groups), "the Office of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights said in response to a request from Radio Svoboda.
During the entire period of the conflict, from April 14, 2014 to January 31, 2021, civilians accounted for 25-26 percent of the total number of people killed in the conflict (3375 out of 13100-13300). The same ratio applies to injuries.
It should be noted that this ratio has changed significantly over the years: from 33-34 percent in 2014 (one civilian killed for two killed Ukrainian soldiers or members of armed groups), to 4-5 percent in 2019-2020: one civilian , killed in artillery shelling, fire from SZLO (small arms and light weapons - ed. ) and incidents involving mines on 20-22 Ukrainian soldiers or members of armed groups killed in artillery shelling, fire from SZLO and incidents "related to mines," the UN said.
Notice that most of the people killed or injured were Ukrainians, and far fewer civilians were killed. The 14,000 number is pure propaganda.
As the UN noted, only one civilian was killed in 2019-2020 in the Donbass, and yet Putin has launched an invasion that has killed thousands already in a couple of weeks.
“I actually studied history.”
Talk about impressive! So answer his question, he’s not the only one curious to know what your life experience might be.
I’m think you’re obtuse
I’ve a poli sci degree from ole miss
Means only that I went to the trouble nothing more
No article at the link. Also, I don’t recognize the source. Also, that is all you have?
Sorry, but that is awfully thin for so serious an allegation.
No article at the link. Also, I don’t recognize the source. Also, that is all you have?
Sorry, but that is awfully thin for so serious an allegation.
Google Ukrainian Civil War. The figures are universally accepted.
Maybe Putin should start at home with his de-nazification...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Vladimir_Zhirinovsky
Who is adopting the language of whom??? Putin sounds like a democrat and the democrats sound like Putin. I’m waiting for Putin to say he is defending “democracy” from “white supremacy” and “structural racism.” He already uses the other democrat talking points. Or is it the democrats who have so swallowed Putin (D-Moscow) propaganda over the years he is actually driving their agenda?
[NorseViking #46] Where have you been for 8 years when Ukraine was killing 14,000 people in Donbas?[Belteshazzar #48] What are your sources for this 14,000 number? Give the links. Or, if not on the net, give the citations.
[freeandfreezing #50] According to published sources the actual number of civilians killed in that fighting is nowhere close to 14,000.
[Belteshazzar #54] No article at the link. Also, I don’t recognize the source. Also, that is all you have?
I also found the NorseViking link at #46 to be noted as without textual content at this time.
The claim at #46 refers to people, not civilians. The actual claim of 14,000 deaths appears substantiated and attributable the Ukranian government.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Russo-Ukrainian_War
War in DonbasMain article: War in Donbas
The overall number of confirmed deaths in the war in Donbas, which started on 6 April 2014, has been put at 13,100–13,300, by 31 January 2021.[9] According to the Ukrainian government, 14,000 were killed by 13 May 2021.[10]
TOTAL 13,100–13,300 killed
6 April 2014 – 31 January 2021
United Nations[9]TOTAL 14,000 killed
6 April 2014 – 13 May 2021
Ukrainian government[10]Civilians 3,393 killed (312 foreign)
6 April 2014 – 30 September 2021
United Nations[11]UAF, NGU and volunteer forces 4,641 killed[note 1]
6 April 2014 – 23 February 2022
Museum of Military History[7][12][13]DPR and LPR forces 5,772 killed
6 April 2014 – 11 February 2022
United Nations & DPR[9][14]Russian Armed Forces 400–500 killed[note 2]
6 April 2014 – 10 March 2015
US State Department[15]
The Wikipedia source link goes to a TASS article of 13 May 2021 quoting a speech by Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmitry Kuleba.
This is further attributed by various well known sources. A sampling follows:
More than 14,000 people have been killed in seven years of fighting between Ukrainian troops and the Russia-backed separatists.
Russia annexed Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula in March 2014 after the country's former Russia-friendly president was driven from power by protests. Moscow then threw its weight behind separatists in eastern Ukraine, and the conflict there has killed more than 14,000 people in seven years.
Russia annexed Crimea in 2014 and threw its support behind a separatist rebellion in eastern Ukraine. More than 14,000 people have been killed in the fighting, which has devastated also Donbas, Ukraine’s industrial heartland.
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said direct talks with Moscow were needed to end the war in the east, which Kiev says has killed more than 14,000 people.
Thank you.
What I wasn’t necessarily questioning was the number. But the statement of NorseViking was: “Where have you been for 8 years WHEN UKRAINE WAS KILLING 14,000 people in Donbas? This conflict didn’t start two weeks ago.”
NorseViking can easily fix this if he restates what he said to line up with the many citations you provided. Let us see if he will. Perhaps, in the emotion of the moment in speaking of this war and the fog that envelopes it, he misspoke.
In the end, facts are stubborn things, and the truth will out. Both Putin and Zelenskiy will go before the tribunal of both history and justice for what they have done, not what some say this or that one did.
Thank you! Aren’t the troops people who are killed in the conflict?
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