Free Republic
Browse · Search
Bloggers & Personal
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Knife vs Gun
Am Shooting Journal ^ | 4/3/2018 | J Hines

Posted on 04/03/2018 5:20:15 AM PDT by w1n1

Lets Revisit the 21 Foot Rule Concept
The 21 foot rule drill is well known within the law enforcement and personal defense circle. This defensive drill was patterned after a Salt Lake City Police Sergeant Dennis Tueller experimentation.

The Tueller drill is all about "reactionary gap" through training. Other trainers have come up with the distances associated it to the Tueller drill. This experimentation, determined that the average healthy adult male can cover a distance of seven yards (21 feet) in about 1.5 seconds.

Training Scar
According to Force Science Research Center the old way of training was to stop the scenario when the defender gets off the first shot at the perpetrator. This type of training and mentality of "bang you're dead" leads to a false sense of safety, this is a "training scar". A training scar is a negative trait that's come as a result of bad training practices.

Another training scar that is common in shooting is how we are all conditioned to stand on the firing line and shoot at a static target. For this reason, most Law Enforcement Officers and civilian gun owners step in concrete the minute their gun leaves the holster.
Safety was the primary motive to reinforce training with firearm. If there were any movement implemented into the training. It was limited to movements to perpendicular or lateral movements in relations to the target.

Alternative Solutions
Force Science Research Center provides an alternative way is to turn the "Tueller concept" into an actual drill as a force on force exercise. Basically, the drill extends to another 10-15 seconds, rather than stopping on the first bang you're dead. We have to get rid of the "Bang! You're dead" mentality. This gives the participants a chance to utilize any tactics (techniques) to survive.
Here's a few alternative ways to train with a gun, see below - read the rest and see the full footage on knife vs guns story here.


TOPICS: Hobbies; Outdoors
KEYWORDS: 21footrule; 7yardrule; banglist; defensivetraining; knifevsguns

1 posted on 04/03/2018 5:20:15 AM PDT by w1n1
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: w1n1

Just like that kid in the zombie movie said, it all boils down to CARDIO.


2 posted on 04/03/2018 5:28:28 AM PDT by TonyM (UPS)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: w1n1
A bad man that really knows how to use a knife scares me more than a bad man with a gun. If you let him get close, even with a bullet or two in him, he is gonna carve you up.

Best to empty the gun on him and reload.


3 posted on 04/03/2018 5:29:38 AM PDT by Delta 21 (Build The Wall !! Jail The Cankle !!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Delta 21

Re vid: “Jello no hit back.”


4 posted on 04/03/2018 5:32:07 AM PDT by Pearls Before Swine ("Married with children.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: w1n1

always look to maneuver to get something between you and anyone that causes internal alarm bells to go off. A parked car, a lamp post, telephone pole, trash can - anything to slow the guy down enough so that you can draw your weapon.


5 posted on 04/03/2018 5:35:03 AM PDT by circlecity
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: w1n1

If you don’t practice move n shoot, you are wasting your time.


6 posted on 04/03/2018 5:35:06 AM PDT by clee1 (We use 43 muscles to frown, 17 to smile, and 2 to pull a trigger. I'm lazy and I'm tired of smiling.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Pearls Before Swine

Especially after that first slice to the jugular.


7 posted on 04/03/2018 5:58:14 AM PDT by Delta 21 (Build The Wall !! Jail The Cankle !!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: clee1

“If you don’t practice move n shoot, you are wasting your time.”.....

And, just keep shooting until your attacker stops or you run out of ammo.


8 posted on 04/03/2018 5:59:06 AM PDT by DaveA37
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Delta 21

The dude is quick! Stabby, stabby, stabby. It’s hard to believe the video isn’t sped up a little.


9 posted on 04/03/2018 6:06:12 AM PDT by Pearls Before Swine ("Married with children.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Delta 21

Sure, attack a man with no arms and legs...


10 posted on 04/03/2018 6:09:28 AM PDT by WayneS (An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. - Winston Churchill.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Delta 21

11 posted on 04/03/2018 6:16:56 AM PDT by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Yo-Yo

21 feet is for ANY assailant—even the fat slob with the knife will getcha.


12 posted on 04/03/2018 6:27:24 AM PDT by Flintlock (The ballot box STOLEN, our soapbox taken away--the BULLET BOX is left to us.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: WayneS
Sure, attack a man with no arms and legs...

"We'll call it a draw."


13 posted on 04/03/2018 6:31:48 AM PDT by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: w1n1

Not many civilians are able to draw and fire from CCW in 1.5 seconds.

To me this means extending the threat distance (25 ft.) and drawing earlier in the perception of threat.


14 posted on 04/03/2018 6:42:41 AM PDT by G Larry (There is no great virtue in bargaining with the Devil)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: G Larry

This is one point in favor of pocket carry vs. waistband carry. I can put my hands in my pocket, grasp the firearm in a drawing grip, and look ‘normal.’ IWB or OWB means putting my hand on my hip, a threatening motion that has on more than one occasion resulted in a charge of brandishing.


15 posted on 04/03/2018 7:21:28 AM PDT by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: G Larry

I’m thinking 300 yards. That gives me time to get the rifle out of the case.


16 posted on 04/03/2018 8:16:51 AM PDT by Do_Tar (To my NSA handler: Only kidding.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Delta 21

He can probably safely stop stabbing the guy when he’s been decapitated. What’s the point of stabbing the neck where the head was once attached?


17 posted on 04/03/2018 12:59:48 PM PDT by CommerceComet (Hillary: A unique blend of arrogance, incompetence, and corruption.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Yo-Yo
"We'll call it a draw."

I wondered what happened to the Black Knight. I'm happy that he was able to pursue a new career, although I'm not quite sure how much of a career there is in being a ballistics dummy.

18 posted on 04/03/2018 1:03:58 PM PDT by CommerceComet (Hillary: A unique blend of arrogance, incompetence, and corruption.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: CommerceComet

It looked like he was channeling his inner “Crip” or “Blood”, or perhaps just enjoying himself a bit too much.

I never wanna be the target of his frustrations!


19 posted on 04/04/2018 6:48:53 AM PDT by Delta 21 (Build The Wall !! Jail The Cankle !!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: Delta 21
I never wanna be the target of his frustrations!

For sure!

20 posted on 04/04/2018 9:01:28 AM PDT by CommerceComet (Hillary: A unique blend of arrogance, incompetence, and corruption.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Bloggers & Personal
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson