Posted on 11/09/2014 2:26:34 PM PST by marktwain
Even worse. Scenario - we go hunting.. I have a brand new 12g. We swap guns for a few ducks so you can try it out.
Nothing wrong, huh? We are now BOTH in violation of the law. There was no transfer permit issued allowing that "transfer" between us.
Totally unenforcable other than to muck up the life of legal gun owners. Which is the real intent of this.
Oddly - you CAN loan it to someone if they are going hunting and have a hunting license. I’m not even sure you have to be with them on the hunt.
Just don’t loan it to them at the shooting range to get some practice. The first time is a misdemeanor $10,000 fine and a year in jail). The second time is a felony and they’ll take away all your guns.
It’s pretty bad when you have to lie or deceive to get a bill passed. Repeal it after its shown what’s in it. Sounds sort of familiar....
I’m still looking for the “loopholes” you mentioned. Perhaps you might deign to show them to us?
I even posted a chart so we slow learners can follow your diagramming of these gaps you claim.
http://sos.wa.gov/_assets/elections/initiatives/FinalText_483.pdf
Here is a pdf of the whole ugly 18 pages.
You can loan a gun for hunting, at the range and to someone who is in danger from a stalker or ex-wife etc..
See this is the problem - too much confusion on the law and what it allows or doesn't. Most hunters and quite a few conservatives voted YES because of the confusion!
I really hope someone stops this in the courts but I'm not counting on the NRA because they were AWOL on this. The GOA didn't run any ads either but they did squeal on FB quite a bit!
The only loopholes I can think of is with a close family member that you can gift to.
“Here brother, I gift grandad’s old shotgun to you.”
After brother’s shoulder is sore after four rounds of trap, “Here brother, I gift grandad’s old shotgun to you.”
Although I imagine a good lawyer has some fancy Latin term for that, and that it wasn’t REALLY a gift.
“However, if you want to go shooting with your son or grandson, you can’t loan them your gun at the shooting range! Gifts are okay, transfers (not just sales) are illegal.”
As I read it, transfers at a shooting range are only legal if the range is one approved by the local government; and the transfers consist of transfers of firearms that are permanently kept at the range.
Much of this will likely be settled in the courts...
(f) The temporary transfer of a firearm (i) between spouses or domestic partners;
(ii) if the temporary transfer occurs, and the firearm is kept at all times, at an established shooting range authorized by the governing body of the jurisdiction in which such range is located;
Post 25 has the entire law.
You can loan it to anyone going hunting if they have a legal hunting license.
You can loan it to your spouse at a shooting range, or to someone under the age of 18.
I would NOT be able to let my 20-year old son shoot my gun at the range, or anyone else that is above 18 and not my spouse.
You can loan your gun to someone that is in “imminent” danger. I’m not sure how long that is, but letting your daughter have your old shotgun in her apartment after her breakup with an angry and threatening boyfriend would not be considered “imminent”.
Is there any particular reason you addressed that to me? I don’t recall mentioning any “loopholes”.
Interesting on the “kept at all times, at an established shooting range...”
I read that as I can loan my gun to my spouse as long as she only has it at the range. But I see what you are saying.
No different than most politicians getting elected.
Those attempting to fight fire with fire got us burned very badly.
I-594 should have been opposed simply because it violated "....shall not be infringed". Period.
They won’t know, but if a firearm was purchased in the last few years and then sold or given to another and someone, for some reason or another (owner acquiescing to an otherwise illegal search during a traffic stop etc...) run the serial it will show up as illegally transferred and then both players in the transaction are in for grief.
It will be a LOT more effective once Washington gets a registration system in place, and you can bet your butt that will be on the agenda down the line. CA started off with pistols, and in the last few years included long guns and most recently the specific type of long gun.
I.e. if you bought an AR in CA more than a year ago, you’re only registered as owning a long gun, if you buy one now, you’re registered as owning an AR...
“It will be a LOT more effective once Washington gets a registration system in place, and you can bet your butt that will be on the agenda down the line.”
Yes, that is the pattern. Pass a law based on false premises, then, when it is ineffective, say it wasn’t enough, we need more! That has been the pattern for 50 years or more.
“I.e. if you bought an AR in CA more than a year ago, you’re only registered as owning a long gun, if you buy one now, you’re registered as owning an AR...”
That doesn’t seem very fair. And being a liberal is all about being “fair”.
Solution? People will have to provide the name and serial number of ALL their old guns too.
Here in Washington state they are already talking about all the new bills they are going to bring to the legislature because the “people” have spoken.
However, we also elected more Republicans, and have even more control of the state house and senate than before, so hopefully those new bills will die.
If you’re a voter, there are rules...
If it wants money: Vote NO
If you have any doubts about it, or it’s confusing: Vote NO
The morons in this state (CA) actually voted to release a crap load of convicted criminals (Prop 47) because the damn thing was titled “The Safe Neighborhoods and Schools Act of 2014”
I swear, if you vote for something that you can’t even define you should lose your right to vote for 1 or 2 cycles...
“...was titled “The Safe Neighborhoods and Schools Act of 2014”
Must have been the same people that came up with the name “Affordable Health Care Act”
Hypothetically: You can have “gifted” a weapon to anyone born before the initiative goes into effect. The burden of proof that this is otherwise will be impossible for prosecution and the defense for the under 18 at gifting would be that this was to be “handleable” under adult supervision at such as as deemed capable.
Hypothetically: Another means would be to take either a certain subset, or all of ones weapons, and roll them into an NFA trust and list those whom they could possibly be either lent or gifted to as beneficiaries.
You should have seen the ads for THAT one! They actually had a guy deliver their “rationale” stating that all the money we would “save” by early release could be plowed into safer schools. Their guarantee was that some unknown somebodies vouched for the “low-risk” felons.
We are so screwed in this state!
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