Posted on 10/29/2023 11:10:36 AM PDT by RandFan
Matthew Perry debating the topic of addiction with a dismissive Peter Hitchens in 2013
(Excerpt) Read more at twitter.com ...
Having seen addiction run its course it’s pretty clear that it’s a neurological issue.
Hitchens is an ignorant snob in this video.
Does Hitchens think that a lack of willpower is what has people drink until they lose their job, their home, their family and frequently their life? Does he think they willingly put drinking above their children and spouse?
I don’t claim to know the answer, but Hitchens won that debate hands down.
Perry used appeal to authority, then sarcasm, then condescension and personal attacks, then - when asked what the objective physical evidence of addiction was - Perry closed with “you don’t know what you’re talking about”.
Then, whoever posted the video cut it right there to give Perry the last word.
My guess is Hitchens had a pretty good response - why else cut it there?
I can only speak for me. 34 years off the bottle this past Wednesday. There are people who believe it is moral weakness. I just know I had the old time Bill Wilson fellowship and loving and wonderful strangers who I could call in the middle of the night. In return I got sent into noxious hotel rooms where similar hopeless people smoked and vomited and begged to stop. There were no treatment centers full of licensed fools back then.
Hardest thing I ever did, but also the most wonderful.
It takes a tremendous amount of will power to quit an addiction, right?
So what is so unreasonable about saying that will power is lacking in people who can’t quit an addiction?
Hitchens is not saying addiction dies does not exist, he is objecting to the idea of calling it physical disease or “allergy of the body”.
No one wants to quit more than the addict or alcoholic.
It’s a choice. Any addiction can be overcome. It’s mostly habit. Perry said it himself...if he didnt’ have that first drink he would be fine. So he loses his willpower to NOT have that first drink.
While I have some bad habits, insobriety is not one of them. It was revealing to learn from watching a friend, however, how some seem to process intoxicants differently. The euphoria wears off and it’s like being cold for them. The urge to reconnect is primal, like seeking warmth.
For me, it’s not willpower that keeps me sober. I just can’t imagine getting anything done while wasted.
Alcoholism and drug addiction are two “diseases” that are 100% self inflicted.
Such diseases are a function of a weakness of character rather than a physical weakness. For me, I didn’t have the strength of character to be the man God created me to be. So, I wallowed in self-righteous and self-indulgent self-medicating. I wasted a solid chunk of the best years of my life being stoned and stupid. By returning to the Way of My Lord, Jesus, I’ve found peace and strength; the peace and strength I was looking for in booze and dope.
I’ve been straight and sober for nearly 40 years following a 15-year reign of terror as a bat-sh!t, crazy drunk and recreational drug user. All glory to God.
They are the most narcissistic, spoiled, entitled, and selfish people I've ever come across in life. Everything bad that happens to them is someone else's fault, and even their addiction is not their fault.
I worked as a clinical consultant in a triservice alcohol and substance abuse program - ASAP - for 3 years after spending over a decade myself in ACOA and AA. I came to the conclusion there are no addictions, only choices. What I found working for people who remained sober (not using) was a clearly defined reason that meant everything to them.
Users are liars- to themselves, family, friends, God, and choosing not to use wholeheartedly seemed to be what made the difference I saw and experienced myself in deciding to quit smoking after 20 years.
There are no addictions, no addictive personalities, addiction genes, people quit using all the time and stay quit by choice.
JMHMO
I do think some people are more susceptible to things like alcohol. Fighter ace Pappy Boyington was not a drinker, one day he was offered one drink, and from that moment on he could not get enough of it...I’ve had a few drinks and did not have that response. People are allergic to different types of food. But at the end of the day stopping an addiction is act of willpower...some people can do it, and others can’t.
That's true.
If I don’t drink the first drink I can’t get drunk
For me it'll be 34 years come February. It works when you work it, right?
In the same way it takes will power to beat cancer or heart disease or glaucoma.
So what is so unreasonable about saying that will power is lacking in people who can’t quit an addiction?
Is it unreasonable to say will power is lacking in people who aren't cured of a disease yet? If they'd just get some will power they'd cure it.
Hitchens is not saying addiction dies does not exist, he is objecting to the idea of calling it physical disease or “allergy of the body”.
I disagree on both parts. He is implying that addiction does not exist, that addicts lack the will power to stop and that said lack of will power is the sole source of the problem. Luckily, he is not an addict [neither am I but I have known a number of them closely.]
I stand by my assertion - Hitchens is ignorant. The fundamental problem in discussing the issue is that those who have not had experience with the issue or lived through a loved one suffering from addiction are simply ignorant. They're not being intentionally vicious, they just don't understand.
Addiction is chemical. Propensity for addiction is genetic/ biological. Willpower has very little to do with it. And keep in mind, on some level we’re all addicts. Endorphins trigger your opiate receptors. Anything you do for fun, anything that triggers that endorphins release, especially if you KNOW it’s going to, is, in the strictest sense, an addiction. And being a jerk seems to trigger Hitchens’ endorphins. So maybe he should use his willpower.
Addiction is chemical.
For many it is a habit, a behavior. behaviors are complex
Many drunks/druggies are not chemically addicted.
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