Posted on 10/07/2015 7:54:10 PM PDT by dayglored
If there's one message that stands out from Microsoft's big device day launch on Tuesday it's this: stop thinking about Redmond as the cheap option, because it wants to be seen as the premium brand.
For years Microsoft has sold itself as the dominant ecosystem for computing that won't cost you too much. The device day focus, however, shows that Microsoft is intent on going after the big spenders in the IT industry.
Take the Surface Book, for example. Again and again Microsoft hammered the message that this was the ultimate laptop, with no expense spared. That's reflected in the price – $1,500 will get you the base unit but you can spent nearly three grand on a top-of-the-range system with dual graphics chips and a terabyte of solid state storage.
That's a hell of a lot for a laptop. You can pick up a good-enough laptop for a tenth of the price of a top-of-the-range Surface Book running Windows. But there's a market for people willing to spend a fortune on top-spec hardware, both in the gaming market and also for the executive who likes to show off a bit.
... (fairly long, in-depth article) ...
(Excerpt) Read more at theregister.co.uk ...
Linux's problems as a desktop OS are two-fold: 1) there's no space for it in the marketplace, and 2) it's not Windows.
If Linux looked and worked just like Windows, and could run Windows software seamlessly, it would be massive by now, because it's free.
But it never will be Windows, so as you say, Windows will have to die first before the Linux desktop has a chance in hell.
OTOH, in the server marketplace, Linux rules and its strengths are manifest. That's clearly its proper place.
So MS has built a machine for the .001% of the user population who are going to go buy a windows machine to put Linux on it? Sounds like a winning business plan to me.
You’re being pretty short sighted. Do you think PCs are built solely for Windows? This new platform is not forced to run Windows like Apple platforms are. That was my point. And yes, MS is building a lot of stuff lately to be cross-platform. That’s evidenced by their recent announcements concerning SSH on the new server platforms and others.
“Yeah, the same OS which will be in over a billion PCs and other devices within 3 years. What a problem!!!”
Yep, the majority of which will are dirt cheap and sell for well under $1000.... Sorry, but the market for high end hardware for the PC market is basically gamers... Windows machines sell because of cost points, a high end PC running windows has a market demand of next to nothing.. Its the VALUE play, that’s all its got. Will a small percentage of windows buyers pay for high end hardware? Sure.. but the majority aren’t going to give something like this consideration
Windows is the Walmart of the PC world, tons of low end low margin products making up the overwhelming majority of sales, because the 90%+ of the market is not going to pay a premium for it.. One can spend $1500 for a pc running windows with high end components... or one can spend $500 for a pc running windows with cheap components... both will equally perform the tasks th do most, surf the web, watch youtube and porn and send email and word process on.
“It’s also the same OS which OSX users need to install in order to get anything productive or value done.”
If you believe that, you really are about 20 years out of touch.
Lets check the sales figures in 12 months and see where this thing lands, particularly if we are privy to the give away factor MS will probably do to prop up its numbers just like it has done with the Surface Pros.
You fail to realize, or you fail to mention, that Microsoft was not in the business of doing the hardware side of PCs. Thus, most of the complaints regarding Windows, were the result of the hardware failures and driver failures, which to many users, were manifested through the OS.
Now that Microsoft is involved with the hardware side too, the complaints about their hardware are few and minor. People blamed ALL problems on Windows when the majority of them were hardware-based and driver-based.
Having said that, there is NOTHING that Apple has done with their hardware that wasn’t being done by one or more of the Windows OEMs. While some were poor quality, others were of very high-quality and even superior in quality to the Apple stuff. Fact is that, every PC that I ever owned, didn’t have hardware problems, no matter the brand. The quality of Apple stuff is mostly hype. The fanaticism for Apple stuff is real and not hype. No doubt, now that the Surface devices and the Lumia phones are of the same or better quality as the Apple stuff, the Apple fanatics will still feel loyal to their mother Apple, and continue purchasing the Apple stuff, even if it’s inferior stuff.
No doubt that Holo-lens will have many different applications. The Holo-TV will be one of them. ;)
Sorry, but your assumptions are incorrect, you can indeed install Linux, or any other OS for that matter if you would like on a Mac.. .its a piece of hardware, there is nothing that prevents you from changing out the OS if you choose to... So, that argument is incorrect.
I think a PC being sold with the MS OS on it is indeed being built to run that OS, otherwise the PC manufacturer has no reason to pay MS royalties to ship the machine with the MS OS... Last I checked no business is willing to spend money for something they don’t want or need if they have a choice.
I think this PC in particular is being built to be a Windows machine, because well, first and foremost its Microsoft... and they aren’t building machines to show off Linux, anymore than Apple would be. But you certainly could install it if you wanted.
However, and again, the market share for folks who are going to buy this to install Linux on it, is the same market share that are going to buy a macbook pro to install linux on it... insanely nominally small.
I love Unix, but the percentage of laptop owners running it, if you don’t count OSX as a Unix derivative, which it is, is a percentage of the marketplace that doesn’t measure a 100th of a percentage point.
That’s not short sighted, that’s the truth.
As I have said to others, lets wait a year and check the sales figures, and if we can filter out the give away numbers MS will certainly have to prop it up, lets see where things stand then.
Maybe, but it doesn't really fit the "augmented reality" paradigm. People tend to try to make watching TV or movies an "immersive" experience that blocks out and replaces the ambient environment. There's better options available in the VR arena for that.
For instance, I bought a laptop in 2009--six years ago--with a quad-core i7, 1TB RAIDed 7200rpm drives, DVD writer, HDMI, 8GB RAM (now expanded to 16GB), USB 2.0 and USB 3.0, 17" 1920x1080 screen. Cost me a lot more than the average--but it's lasted me at least 6 years, and I foresee no upgrade in the near future.
IOW--the upfront costs are more, but I believe you save more in the long run.
What MS is aiming for with the Surface devices, is a decent number of sales that will keep it profitable and alive. But, mostly, MS has been designing and developing ideas via the Surface line that, hopefully, will lead the Windows OEMs to come out with a lot more desirable devices. Windows was not the problem with PCs. Microsoft was not the problem with PCs. The problem was that the OEMs were producing devices that could attract people to Windows.
When it comes to ‘dirt cheap’ devices, the real fact is that, even those cheap devices were and are very capable, and can do most of all of the same stuff that an Apple Mac can do. Most consumers don’t need the $2,000-$3,000 PC to do whatever they need to do. Apple stuff is about status and showing off and bragging. There really is no need for super-expensive PCs, or even expensive tablets or expensive smartphones. For what the vast majority of people do with their devices, a $150 smartphone will do, and a $300-$800 PC will do. When even the cheap stuff lasts as long as the expensive stuff, and can basically do the same stuff, then, the higher prices are about status and bragging rights and being cool.
Then, imagine a Hololens TV set, where 3d is the standard, and surround sound is also standard, and where you get 360-degree viewing of a movie. YOu are not just watching a movie at that point; you become immersed and could be interacting with what you see.
I think Microsoft's objective with the Surface devices is not to create a profit center, but to set a benchmark.
What you are describing is a VR experience, not the "augmented reality" experience that the HoloLens is designed to created.
Don’t try to win an argument with the anti apple crowd/contrarians, they don’t and won’t listen to anything that doesn’t jive with “you are all stupid, you pay too much for crappy stuff, you are just lemmings”.
I spent the better part of 3 decades bashing Apple, and deservedly so. My debates with Apple users go all the way back to the Apple II days, when I had friends spending thousands of dollars on machines that a $200 Commodore 64 could blow out of the water. There was a time that Apple was offering very little other than brand loyal overpriced stuff.
However, there was even back then, once the Macintosh came into being, a valid argument that Mac’s were simpler to use for the average Joe. And that argument remains valid to this day, even though MS Windows did simplify somewhat it never got to the MAC level.... then at a time when it finally should have been closing that gap.. MS went and unleashed Windows 8 and just re-enforced the reality.
I work on all sorts of systems, Windows, Mac, Unix flavors, I write software for all of them as well as various mobile platforms as well. The reality is simple, and some folks won’t accept it, that apple’s ecosystem is simple to use and highly integrated and works well. Its a fine choice for the typical user. Are there fan boys? Of course, and is everything they do revolutionary no? Does the company try to sell every little tweak as the greatest thing since sliced bread and overhype things? Yep.... but so does every other company out there... Waterproof S5’s anyone? The rabid apple fans deserve to be mocked, the folks who will wait in line for 48 hours to be the first to own X or Y deserve to be mocked for that sort of mania that they seem to have... but Apple has long ago left the realm of marketing products to just them. They have won over a lot of folks for delivering on promises and providing good products.
My personal realization that Apple was not the laughable horrible beast of my youth, was the first time I had to contact support, and for the first time in over a decade I got to talk to someone who spoke English as a first language. Yes the product I purchased that I called for support on was expensive for what it was, I could have bought another brand with similar hardware specs for less, but no way I would have gotten the support I did from them... There was something more to the company than the fanboy idiots.
I use and write software on tons of different hardware and from many different vendors and platforms. Bashers of Apple, generally fall into two camps these days.... Contrarians, who are just going to be against whoever is the dominant player in any market no matter what, and folks who are more against/offended by the apple fandboys than they are against Apple itself.
I agree that Apple will elicit this sort of response from some personality types no matter what... When I have to watch a video of Johnny trying to tell me why this apple thing is the greatest thing since sliced bread, I myself find myself rolling my eyes often... but its marketing, its all smoke and mirrors no matter what company is doing it. I do the same thing when I watch google IO presentations as they try to oversell something they’ve done as well.
MS sadly shot itself in the foot long ago as a tech driver, and I don’t see it regaining that crown again. It isn’t going away, and it may even come up with a cool thing now and again, but a driver of tech, not likely. Ballmer and Gates wrecked that possibilities in the late 90s.. They missed many opportunities to lead because they were worried about protecting their turf, and they paid the price. MS isn’t going anywhere, but its not going to change the landscape.
I’m sure the machine is a fine machine spec wise, but I fully expect a year from now, its sales will be paltry, because there is only so much market for a high end windows PC... that’s just the reality. There is a high end windows PC market today with great spec hardware in it from manufacturers, sticking a windows logo on your own box doesn’t create a new marketplace... the existing marketplace for this is limited, and MS’s machine is just another machine in it.
*scratches head*
Hardware is hardware. If there’s nothing locking down the hardware to a specific OS, then you can install whatever you want on the hardware. There’s nothing unique about the hardware MS chose for their new platform. It’s all industry-standard hardware. Microsoft isn’t in the hardware manufacturing business.
Not sure if you didn’t read what I wrote, or you are responding to someone else. I pointed out that exact point multiple times.
The Surface devices division is already a profit center, and while it’s true that they wish to set standards and benchmarks for the OEMs to follow, I’m pretty sure that Microsoft is in the market to grow the Surface devices and make as much as possible. It will be like what Google does with their Nexus devices, but with the Surface devices, Microsoft can be a lot more profitable.
With the lead they now hold in the 2-in-1 devices, it’s unlikely that MS will stop as just setting examples. It would be foolish of HS to not go for a huge increase in their market share of PCs. If setting examples was all there was to it, they could have stopped at just doing the Surface Pro devices, but NO!!!, they jumped right into creating tablets too. I’m pretty sure that Apple and Google and the Windows OEMs have taken notice, and that they had better step up their games, otherwise, MS could become the dominant player in the hardware division too, alongside them already being the leading software company on the planet.
Yes, a VR experience, but, with consumers involved, it could be modified and offered as an immersive TV and movie experience.
Dude, the Surface Pros are tablets.
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