Those who know Islam best. I met them I respect them.

Free Republic ^ | May 10, 2015 | WilliamofCarmichael

[WilliamofCarmichael]

What's happened in the Republic of Turkey should be a warning for the United States vis-a-vis Muslim versus Islamists (both religionists and radicals) domestic and foreign.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Those who know Islam best. I met them I respect them.

These images are from protests of about seven years ago -- everything went smoothly, an election was close and the Islamist Ergodan hadn't quite consolidated his power. The millions of protesters did not want Islamism and sharia law. Ergodan promised the voters ("Tac KEY yuh!") he'd respect Turkey's secular heritage.

more here BTW the reply immediately following the link is a picture of the actress the founder of modern secular Republic of Turkey used to date, it's said.

About two years ago this series of protests began as opposition to a project in Istanbul -- protesters were assaulted by the police. article here Erdogan was much closer to the power Islamists seek. Today I've read that judges are threatened with jail if they rule against Erdogan.

for more use both google web and google images: islamism sharia law protests Turkey

An Isflamist (everything he says is flam) who has not quite consolodated his power..

[dp0622]

Turkey gives ISIS free transport and watched as Kurds were fighting for survival. They’ve invested 100m in a mosque in the US, the opening of which Obama said he plans to attend. Ergoden is garbage and im not sure why Turkey is in NATO.

[Travis McGee]

Islam is currently undergoing a major reformation.

Back to its 7th century origins.

[Netz]

Turdkey, I mean Turkey WAS a prime example of Islam and Secularism coexisting.
Ataturk, ensured that the modern Turkey would show, (what is abhorrent to Islam) toleration and cooperation between peoples of different faiths, (as long as they are not Greek, Armenian or Jewish).
NATO WAS proud to have Turkey as a buffer between the West and CCCP during the Cold War. Since Ergodan...descent into hell with the Muslim Brotherhood. Turkey WAS a great ally of Israel until they spit in their faces and sent the MaviMarmara to break the Gaza blockade. The Turks have been on a continuous line of provocation regarding Israel and the West. They are not be trusted and they should be booted out of NATO. To hell with Ergodan and his Islamo-facist regime. Long live Armenia!!!!!!!

[Sherman Logan]

There is some question of course whether Erdogan is a devout Islamist, or whether Islamism is the vehicle he’s riding to the power all dictators want tow wield.

It’s seem pretty likely some of commie dictators weren’t really true believers either. Not that this was much comfort for their victims.

[Koracan]

I met them I respect them...

I met and respect them also

[Hostage]

You are very well informed and tuned in. Glad to see you post so that others can read what you have to say.

I recommend that you format your sentences and paragraphs into smaller pieces to make it easier to read.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Turkey’s Islamist Govt. Building Mega Mosque in U.S.

Yes Erdogan is garbage and one wonders why he keeps Turkey in NATO.

You may not remember but secularist Republic of Turkey was a valuable ally during the Cold War. IIRC if the Soviets attacked Europe the Turks were to immediately open a new front by attacking the Soviets. They were extremely valuable in Korea against the communists American military who were there told me.

The one-million-dollar Islamist mosque disgracing our shores, all the crap going on in Turkey under the control of Islamism -- that's my point. Secularists including Muslims do not want that crap. IMO.

[dp0622]

I wonder how close the last vote was? Didn’t know about Turkey’s involvement in Korea and soviet invasion plans. The thing is that if even only 20 percent of muslims support sharia and isis, that’s 200 million people or more. Boy that’s a lot.

[JayAr36]

Islam = ISIS = Islam. ISIS doing just what their prophet did in spreading Islam across Europe in the 7th century. Moderate Muslims is a myth. There are only two types of Muslim, terrorists and terrorists in waiting. Trust a Muslim at your our risk.

[A Formerly Proud Canadian]

Many on FR complain loudly about the Europeans and how they colonized so much of the world. Yet it was EXACTLY that colonization of the Middle East East and Africa that 'civilized' mohamedanism in the 18th, 19th and early 20th centuries. It was through force of arms that the colonial powers gained control over such states and forced a 'reformation' of mohamedanism. Under the colonial powers, the treatment of women, slavery, corporal punishment, etc. were all forced to improve toward Western standards.

Imams were allowed to preach their koran, but with limits imposed. To continue to preach, imams had to 'soften' the koran. For example, 'jihad' became a personal, spiritual battle, rather than a bloody fight of conquest against all others. This continued for several generation in some countries, many more in others. THIS is where willfully blind liberals like O'Venal get their talking points that islam is a 'religion of peace'. You will note that most WOGs, as they were known, who first came to GB after the independence of India and Pakistan and other Middle Eastern and South Asian former British colonies, were very much Westernized and fit in well in British society. It is now mostly the young, and new comers who vehemently opposed the West.

With the costs of WWI and WWII, the colonial powers had no money or desire to fund their far flung colonies, so they became independent states. Many have reverted to the original, blood thirsty version of islam. Others, like Turkey, are sliding down that path. Only Egypt has put a halt to its slide down that path. How long can the military hold onto a relatively 'peaceful', or at least less bloody islam? Who knows.

To those who have criticized the Europeans for their colonization of much of the world during the 18th through early 20th century, remember that the battle we are in against radical koranic islam, would have happened a century ago or more, were it not for the colonial efforts of the European powers, Great Britain, France, Netherlands, Germany, in previous centuries.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Not sure about the last election but the AK Party did win.

Economically Turkey was doing well at the time. Since then things have changed and Erdogan has faced charges of being corrupt however he has more power than ever;

but maybe most important there was a rift between the AK Party and Turkish Islamist leader, M. Fethullah Gulen, who lives in the U.S., has become a U.S. citizen I believe. Gulen has been very active in Turkey over the past couple of decades.

Here's article from a few years back about the numbers of Turks who totally reject Islamism and sharia.

I recall it was high as 38% when the poll was taken a few years ago.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Erdogan not Islamist? I have read though that he was barred from holding office because of Islamism (1990s). It took a special effort for him to become the Prime Minister after the 2002 (2001?) election. Abdullah Gül served as Prime Minister until Erdogan could take the office legally.

Turkish Islamist leader, M. Fethullah Gulen, who lives in the U.S., has become a U.S. citizen I believe, and heads a movement very active around the world especially in Turkey worked closely with the AK Party and Ergodan.

Both Islamist movements worked for years infiltrating all aspects of Turkey's society.

Lately I believe there's been a falling-out between the two.

[PIF]

If she was wearing grey, then she’d be a hooker ...

[PIF]

The Chinese and the Norks were terrified of them. Common tactic: creep into Chinese camp, slit thoats of everyother man, leave. Never caught.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Good comments. Thanks. I never thought of the role colonization played. Makes sense.

I have no problem with secular Muslims, I do not trust devout Muslims who say they have no designs on our culture but according to Internet sources believe

". . . there has been no social justice or anything like it in any society or civilization before the advent of Islam."

"A human being cannot establish absolute justice because he is just a mere human . . . the divine social justice advocated by Islam is an integrated system for justice enjoined by the Creator of man and all other creatures . . . Justice is Allah’s attribute"

The Koran and other Islamist teaching are everything anyone needs. So how can a devout Muslim (Islamist) reject Allah for our Founding Fathers' mere pittance?

I guess a provoked devout Muslim (Islamist) is an Islamist terrorist.

[Netz]

You are correct. Sometimes I am just BURSTING with writing energy and rush to spill it all out on paper. I will do my best to be better organized and put the thoughts into more, bite-size bits. Thanks.

[El Laton Caliente]

There has never been a civilization coexist with Islam...