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To: DiogenesLamp
I have caught you lying so many times i've lost count.

Asserting that you've "caught me lying" doesn't make it true.

Let me give you a clue here.

In order to show that I've been "caught lying," you need to actually prove that I said things that weren't true. And really, you need to prove that any such misstatement was deliberate and not simply an error. Like other people, I am human and in 2 years of debating this crap it's possible that once or twice I made a statement that wasn't entirely accurate. I seem to recall that I have once or twice, and that I quickly acknowledged and corrected the error.

One of your FAVORITE lies is "ALL AUTHORITIES IN HISTORY AGREE WITH ME." (Proven wrong, countless times.)

To my recollection, I never said "all authorities in history agree with me." I did say that virtually every significant authority in history who has spoken clearly on the matter disagrees with the birther meme, and I stand by that statement because it is true.

And the fact that you can dredge up very minor authorities like Samuel Roberts, or complete non-authorities like David Ramsay, who MIGHT agree with the birther BS, is not a contradiction of that.

You constantly try to assert that John Bingham agrees with you, when clearly he does not, and it has been proven that he does not.

No, it's never been "proven" that he doesn't. You can't provide any statement from Bingham in which he says a child born in the United States to non-citizen parents is anything other than a natural born citizen, because Bingham never made such a statement. Your point with Bingham depends entirely on your interpretation of the words "not subject to any foreign power." That Bingham didn't intend those words to include a child born to non-citizen, non-ambassador parents is evident when one reads the entire context of those debates, and especially when one notes that Bingham was present on the floor of the House when James Falconer Wilson quoted William Rawle stating absolutely that the child born in America of alien parents is a natural born citizen, and neither he nor any other member of Congress made the slightest objection to that.

You claim Bayard agrees with you, when clearly he does not and it has been proven that he does not.

Bayard says absolutely that you don't have to be born in the United States to be a natural born citizen and eligible to be President. You only have to be a citizen by birth. That's all that's required.

So your claim to the contrary is nothing more than an obvious and absolute clown show. Like all remaining birthers, when the evidence flatly contradicts you, you don't say, "Gee, I might be wrong." Instead, you deny the evidence and claim it says the opposite of what it clearly says.

Keep going. You look like a total fool.

You just recently claimed repeatedly that Thomas Jefferson was a citizen of France, and when THAT was proven wrong, you just kept repeating it anyway.

Nathan Dane said very clearly that Thomas Jefferson had been made a citizen of France. You are now at the point where about all you can do is, upon being given evidence that absolutely contradicts you, flatly and stupidly assert that it doesn't.

Keep going. You look like a fool.

420 posted on 08/28/2013 1:46:41 PM PDT by Jeff Winston (Yeah, I think I could go with Cruz in 2016.)
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To: Jeff Winston; C. Edmund Wright
FReeper C.Edmund Wright had a post way back on a different thread and topic which I think sums up this little tete-a-tete very well too ......

... this is like playing chess with a pigeon ... ___ craps the board, knocks the pieces on the floor, and proceeds to strut around like he’s made a point.

422 posted on 08/28/2013 1:57:40 PM PDT by Servant of the Cross (the Truth will set you free)
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To: Jeff Winston
Asserting that you've "caught me lying" doesn't make it true.

Sure it does. We're using JEFF LOGIC here. You always assert that ALL AUTHORITIES IN HISTORY AGREE WITH YOU, and you keep posting that wall of text and CLAIMING they are all authorities, and CLAIMING that they all agree with you, so there isn't really a very heavy standard for proving stuff according to your methodology.

In order to show that I've been "caught lying," you need to actually prove that I said things that weren't true. And really, you need to prove that any such misstatement was deliberate and not simply an error.

No problem. We'll just go with your LATEST lie.

Here is your original INCORRECT assertion. You weren't lying at this point, you were just wrong.

This is where you clarified the original incorrect assertion. (Thomas Jefferson et al were French Citizens.)It wasn't a lie yet, you were just misinformed.

Here it still wasn't a lie yet, you had been misled by Nathan Dane.

This is where you were shown that it was incorrect

And this is where you turned it into a lie

And this is where you repeated the lie. (Thomas Jefferson is a French Citizen.)

And here's where you repeated it again.

Here's where another person notices you are lying.

Here you repeat the lie again.

Another person notices you are lying.

You repeat the lie once again.

ANOTHER person notices you are lying.

Once more you Reassert the lie.

Again, you assert that Jefferson is a Citizen of France.

You Repeat the lie IN BIG RED LETTERS

And you once more defy all evidence, and again assert that THOMAS JEFFERSON IS A NATURALIZED CITIZEN OF FRANCE.

That has been shown to be a lie. You kept repeating it anyway. You ended the thread by repeating it. I don't doubt you may still repeat it, but it is still a lie because it has been demonstrated to be UNTRUE.

And this is just one example. Had I chosen a different topic, I would have had so many examples that it would have taken me days of back checking to find and mark all the occasions when you have repeated a known lie.

Your deliberate attempts to cut out Bingham's words where he explains his meaning about confining citizenship to those children born to people who hold NO FOREIGN ALLEGIANCE is another one of your well known lying episodes. Fortunately for you, i'm not going to backtrack all the examples where I caught you deliberately lying about Bingham's position. I may save that for a future date.

I've been thinking about compiling "Jeff's Greatest Lying hits!" complete with links and all (as in the example above) but It will have to wait for when I have more time, or more motivation to point out HOW OFTEN YOU DELIBERATELY LIE.

At the moment I have no more time to waste debunking your habit of lying.

447 posted on 08/28/2013 6:42:54 PM PDT by DiogenesLamp (Partus Sequitur Patrem)
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