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To: ml/nj
Just because you type the words doesn't make them true. We have no idea how one species might morph into another, but we do know that each species has a characteristic number of chromosomes.

I do not typically type anything that I am not already certain of, through my training and experience (PhD, biochemistry and molecular biology). And before I type it, I verify it. The reason I said what I did about the number of chromosomes not being as important as that the genes exist in pairs, is because of what I know about genetic aberrations. Most trisomies are lethal, not because of the extra chromosome, but because of the extra copy of so many genes. Many genes are only expressed off of one chromosome, with the copy on the other chromosome turned off. Adding an extra chromosome effectively doubles the expression levels of those genes, with what can be devastating effect.

Chimps have 24 pairs of chromosomes, humans 23 pairs. Yet our DNA is ~98% identical, and most of the differences are not in coding regions. Apparently, two early chromosomes combined in humans, giving us approximately the same number of genes as apes, despite having one less chromosome.

As for the other part, how one species morphs into another? All species constantly undergo a certain level of genetic change. It is unavoidable. During the process of meiosis, DNA undergoes some pretty drastic rearrangement, in addition to the normal mutations that always affect DNA. Since these random rearrangements and mutations are mixed into the population through the normal reproductive process, all it takes for speciation to occur is for the population to be split, perhaps by a geological event. At that point, the populations are still undergoing random mutations--but they aren't the same mutations in both populations. Given a long enough separation, the original species becomes two species. This process has been characterized in quite a bit of detail.

131 posted on 03/30/2012 5:36:28 PM PDT by exDemMom (Now that I've finally accepted that I'm living a bad hair life, I'm more at peace with the world.)
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To: exDemMom
I do not typically type anything that I am not already certain of, through my training and experience (PhD, biochemistry and molecular biology). And before I type it, I verify it.

Well, excuse me. We all seem to have our alternate realities, and some of these we call religions. Yours is no different than mine which states that Moses got the Torah at Sinai. There are schools all over the world filled with intelligent folks who believe this either based upon faith or some reasonable logic and then they weave a reality based upon this. The Muslims do the same thing. Your Bible is Darwin.

Unfortunately for you as I said before, or really I plagiarized before the little Darwin says about speciation "is seen by most modern evolutionists as muddled or wrong." This actually comes directly from Coyne and Orr's text, Speciation.

Given a long enough separation, the original species becomes two species.

Speciation is, of course, all any of us "deniers" are talking about when we say that evolution is obviously false. No denies that evolution can take place within a species, as it did with man over the millennia when our different races evolved. But then intercontinental travel began and mirabile dictu we were still all able to breed with one another. I guess you will tell me that our separation wasn't long enough. We all still have our 23 chromosome pairs if we are normal and hope to have grandchildren.

Were there really any gradual morphing of one species into another we would see large numbers of species with mixed chromosome (e.g. 22 and 23 pairs, or 7 and 8) counts but we don't. It's really just simple math. Maybe your PhD didn't include enough if it?

The real evidence that evolution is a fraud comes from evolution textbooks themselves. As I have posted previously, I have Freeman and Herron's Evolutionary Analysis 3rd Edition among other texts. It has 802 pages. It has one chapter on speciation, which is all we're talking about here. The chapter begins on page 583. It runs on to page 614. The rest is primarily fluff, not very different from the stuff in Genesis where Jacob breeds spotted goats. The index references to speciation are: 37, 102-3, 574, 583-614. In other words a book on evolution has 36 pages out of 802 pages which even attempt to touch on the topic. I haven't looked at the speciation chapter recently but my recollection is that it doesn't do much to explain how a new animal species might arise; and answers no questions like the ones I raise here. If you think this is science, you should return your degrees.

ML/NJ

135 posted on 04/01/2012 9:50:42 AM PDT by ml/nj
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