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To: winslow
winslow: "If the US had previously shared a state with parts of Canada so that in some areas the US population outweighed the Canadian, and then the Canadian government started attacking and killing the US citizens in their thousands there would be an outcry and undoubtedly military action."

Total nonsense, because, first, there are around 38 MILLION U.S. expats worldwide, and when they get in trouble with local governments, the U.S. works diplomatically to resolve issues. We don't invade countries for mistreating our expats.

Second, none, zero, abuse you claim Russians received in Ukraine happened before Vlad the Pute invaded, and the reason is obvious, because until that moment, Russians ruled in Ukraine.
Once Vlad invaded, Russians in Ukraine who supported the invasion became, by definition, treasonous and were subject to police or military action.

winslow: "The US carpet bombed Serbia in 1999. "

Rubbish. Precision air strikes with "smart bombs" do not equate to the Russians' indiscriminate bombings of Ukrainian civilian targets, or the kidnapping & killing of Ukrainian civilians.

winslow: " The US invaded Iraq and Afghanistan under false pretences, having blamed them for 9/11. "

That's more nonsense.
The U.S. rightly held the Afghan Taliban responsible for harboring and abetting al Qaeda in launching 9/11/01.
In Iraq the U.S. rightly feared the weapons of mass destruction that Saddam believed he had and threatened his neighbors with.
Nobody has ever admitted they knew ahead of time that Saddam had no such weapons.

winslow: "US did install a puppet government in Ukraine in 2014 after they helped topple Yanukovych.
See Victoria Nuland “F*ck the EU” video where they decided who would make up the new government. "

I cannot defend our Democrats.
I can defend the fact that in 2014 most Ukrainians believed their elections were rigged to put Russians in power in Ukraine.
And I can defend the fact that Ukraine has held multiple lawful elections since 2014, never returning Russians to power.

Indeed, as I understand, the vast majority of Russian speaking Ukrainians oppose Russia's invasion.

114 posted on 01/24/2023 2:31:03 PM PST by BroJoeK (future DDG 134 -- we remember)
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To: BroJoeK

There isn’t an example of a large US population living in one place so that they were a majority being attacked by a foreign entity. So you can’t say the US would respond differently from Russia because this has never happened to the US. I’d wager there would be a major military response if there was a similar situation.

When Ukraine had governments that were more closely aligned with Russia as opposed to the West/NATO there was no conflict between their citizenry. Both sides have a culture and history that is similar and much closer to Russia than the west. The non Russians saw an opportunity for greater economic growth for making overtures to the EU and the US NATO. They would have known in advance that Russia could never accept a NATO member that close to their border. They chose to take this risky provocative action and thought Russia would not do anything.

You can’t defend the US actions over the Cuban Missile crisis and simultaneously defend NATO installing missile batteries in countries in Eastern Europe in close proximity to Russia.

What happened in Serbia was not precision bombing. It was an attack on a sovereign nation who posed no threat to the US. The casualties were mostly civilian also and cluster bombs were used.

Plenty of people were saying there was no evidence of Saddam having nukes or even significant stockpiles of biological or chemical weapons. In the absence of any real proof, the pretext for declaring war was extremely weak or non-existent.

I recognise the Democrat culpability for the most recent US military actions sowing chaos, such as the overthrow of Gadaffi leading to the Arab Spring and elevation of the Muslim Brotherhood and associated terror groups.

I believe the CIA has funded and armed groups like Al Queda and ISIS and almost certainly continues to do so. Many of ISIS fighters were clearly paid mercenaries and Putin has correctly pointed this out. Both groups are now fighting in Ukraine for the Ukrainian/NATO side as has been confirmed by multiple sources from the Islamic world. So you have Nazis, ISIS and Al Queda fighting for Ukraine and you wonder why some of us don’t want to put Ukrainian flags in our Twitter profiles.

Russia is not at all innocent, but they were clearly and repeatedly provoked and their response was totally predictable. The breakup of an empire where you have mixed ethnic populations is always messy, and you only have to look at the breakup of the Austro-Hungarian empire or the breakup of the former Yugoslavia to see this. There was a fine balance which had been tread for decades which was abandoned and the West was deeply involved in sowing the seeds of chaos and discord from the start and is now sacrificing Ukrainians to test out new weapons systems.


121 posted on 01/25/2023 1:13:58 AM PST by winslow
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