Posted on 10/05/2017 7:38:40 AM PDT by COUNTrecount
LVMPD audio: ‘There are at least two shooters with fully-automatic weapons’ Posted on October 5, 2017 by Shepard Ambellas Leaked LVMPD audio reveals how the mainstream media is hiding crucial details about last Sunday’s shooting at the Route 91 music festival in Las Vegas
(INTELLIHUB) — Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department audio captured during last Sunday’s active shooting at Mandalay Bayresort and casino reveals how officers confirmed that there were at least two shooters firing down onto the crowd of concertgoers attending the Route 91 music festival.
After a series of fully-automatic gunfire popped off and people started getting struck by flying rounds a team of law enforcement officers and another ‘element’ stormed the 32nd floor of the Mandalay Bay it was feared that there was an additional shooter on the 29th floor.
“We have a four-man team up here and we have another element moving to us. We will need the 29th floor,” one officer said. “It sounds like it’s confirmed, there are at least two shooters with fully-automatic weapons.”
Additionally, the audio recordings also reveal that a black Chevy dually pickup truck fled the parking lot during all of the commotions and that an older white male who was wearing fatigues and carrying a black bag was spotted retreating into a white RV by the Tropicana and the Motel 6. Pedestrians said that the man came from the area of the shooting.
Pedestrians said that the man came from the area of the shooting and a team eventually converged on the white RV.
At one point, a police car was commandeered by an unknown suspect while the two elements on the 32nd floor were cleared for 335 Zebra’s approach to the northernmost room. READ MORE Forensic Psychiatrist Suggests Gunman May Have Deliberately Targeted Conservatives
“This is 335 Zebra. I need to know if we have that floor evacuated other than our suspects. We got […] sniper going up,” a voice called out over the radio.
That’s when 720 called in an confirmed he had a 12 man element entering the east side of the Mandalay Bay.
[End Audio]
It’s important to note that their may be a total media blackout and that other hotels may have been targeted.
Keep in mind, the New York Times failed to report the hard details in the conglomerate piece titled “Chaos at a Concert and a Frantic Search at Mandalay Bay.”
#MediaBlackout
It is reported that the lower floor windows open. Especially the fourth floor where they had reports of a second shooter.
Someone from my local gun store in Mesquite Texas called into WBAP this morning, and claiming that Paddock bought two guns from them last year.
Is there a grassy knoll nearby? /s
= = =
That would be a Glassy knoll.
I still wonder about the sheriffs comment, that he has a suspect in custody. No one questioned him on that, but does that mean he has a live suspect, or was that his way of referring to the dead guy?
The 4th floor is a red herring. If there was a second shooter, he was either in the room or at a different location, maybe on the roof.
Hotel staff is covering up the second room. Cleaned it upa nd everything. They’re in on it.
Couldn’t be the fact that guy was switching guns and windows and ricochets and echoes were flying everywhere.
the shooter shoots for about 5 minutes and then sits for another hour before shooting in response to a police team outside his door.
From the layout of the room posted on this forum there was an exit door just outside the entrance to his room.
1. Why wait for the police?
2. Is there footage of the stairwell during the hour he wasn’t firing?
3. Is it possible there was no camera on the stairwell, or a camera had been disabled, in order for other shooters to escape and/or blend into the hotel guests population?
4. There was too much planning for this to be an act of “suicide by police”, so what is being covered up?
5. If the plan was to only fire for about 5 minutes, why bring so many weapons into the room?
6. Is it possible that this was a Radical Left operation to take further scrutiny off Hillary and the Dems, and give them reason to call for the removal of the 2nd Amendment? After all to the Left the end justifies the means, and the shooter may have sacrificed himself purposely.
That question was answered within hours after the shooting.
Paddock invested in real estate for decades, eventually amassing a portfolio that included apartment complexes. That was the source of his wealth.
He was shooting at a tightly-packed concert audience of around 20,000 people. It wouldn't matter if the gun's aim went all over the place, he would be hitting SOMEBODY.
How did tempered glsss not break first and fall in the room?
Could this old fat dude create enough force to break the window?
"There is NO WAY in hell that this inexperienced guy was able to hit 500+ people, at a down sloping range of approximately 250-350 yards using a make-shift weapon modified to shot automatically. Here are some reasons why and you can check with other experts to verify my points."
"1. It was dark and no matter how well lit, there are many shadows to hide in.
2. Simple a 'sear' (pronounced see-er) modification would have only permitted one entire magazine to shoot all at once with no select fire (being able to start and stop).
3. There are some devices (like AutoGlove and Bump Fire) that can simulate full automatic fire, but they cannot be used accurately or effectively.
4. Even if the shooter was able to somehow obtain a full normal functioning automatic rifle, anyone with military experience can tell you that the rifles are difficult to control when firing more than 3 round bursts – especially a .308 or AK47 type. This is because the rifle will uncontrollably rise if automatic fire is constant.
5. After the first 15 or so seconds, the crowd scattered and took cover.
6. I don’t have a count of how many pieces of empty brass (fired rounds) they have recovered, but knowing how many shots were fired compared to how many people were hit will tell you the hit ratio. If this guy did this in 20 seconds, we needed him desperately in Afghanistan!
7. To fire 500 aimed shoots and swap out magazines would have taken him about 15-20 minutes, and there is no way that each shot would have hit someone – more than likely would have missed."
"To put in perspective…. Say a guy purchases an expensive bolt action rifle in .308 with a nice expensive scope. Without experience, someone would have to mount the scope for him and do a rough sighting in with a laser. This individual then takes this rifle to a range in broad daylight with no stress and using a bench rest and breathing techniques and all the time in the world and fires at a target 300 yards. It is possible, but doubtful if that person could hit a large refrigerator at that range UNLESS they had LOTS OF PRACTICE and EXPERIENCE. For every 1 minute (1/60th of a degree) of angle change at the rifle, the bullet would vary by 3 inches at 300 yards. For this untrained guy to be wildly shooting with a high heart rate at nighttime? Well, bullets would be going everywhere!"
I fully understand that the estimates of 573 killed and wounded, and the police statement that all the shooting took place in four and half minutes, may be off. These figures may not be precise.
Nevertheless, they are a good and proper starting point. And even allowing for later adjustments, the evidence for multiple shooters and against a lone amateur like Paddock is stunning.
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While I am quite certain that we haven't been told everything that the police/FBI know at this point (and there are actually some good reasons for that), lots of the points made above are simply wrong.
1. Re: it was dark - understand that the target was lit up very well. That there were shadows to hide in only matters with automatic fire if the shooter didn't also aim in the general direction of those shadows. I believe that the shooter KNEW that people would try to hide in shadows, and didn't avoid shooting in those areas - meaning that hiding in the shadows offered only concealment, but not cover (i.e. physical protection). Further, for quite a long period of time, people were being shot and NO ONE knew what was going on (I personally think that this is the period of time - 30 seconds to a minute - when most of the fatalities occurred). Additionally, he had checked out the layout of the concert and its exits and, apparently, one of his early bursts of FA (or simulated FA) fire was directed at one of the exits, so as to keep the crowd in the target area (which was essentially an open field with no cover OR concealment).
2. No one has said squat about there being an auto sear, or any other modification to the trigger system - other than the bump-fire stock(s).
3. Bump-fire stocks can, with practice, be used quite effectively and (for near FA firing) fairly accurately. The open question is: "how much practice did he have with these particular weapons?" Another fact: accuracy, when firing FA at an area target, is not really that important.
4. Re: the rising muzzle of a firearm when firing FA (or near-FA) - this is certainly a factor. However, anyone with even a little experience or a little bit in the way of research skills (or both) could have figured out that you can counter that in 3 ways: first, attach something to the muzzle end to weigh it down a bit, so as to lessen the muzzle rise; second, have a muzzle brake, which LOTS of semi-autos come with from the factory, to reduce muzzle rise; or, third, start firing a FA fusillade at the lower end of your target area, and allow the muzzle rise to automatically (no pun intended) put lead on target toward the higher end of your target area near the middle and end of the fusillade.
5. See #1, above. Some did, many didn't. There was: 1) so much confusion that many didn't know what was going on, or that fleeing was necessary; 2) the shooter targeted one (the only?) exit so as to force his intended victims back into the open field and prevent fleeing; and 3) many people, even if attempting to flee, were tripped/trampled, and remained in the target area.
6. I agree that a brass count is needed - and has probably already been done. I'd like to see that number released, broken down by caliber. FWIW, he did NOT do all of this in 20 seconds. By all reports, the firing occurred over a period of 10-12 minutes.
7. "To fire 500 aimed shoots and swap out magazines would have taken him about 15-20 minutes, and there is no way that each shot would have hit someone – more than likely would have missed."
Excuse me, but BEE ESS!!! FIRST, he was firing bullet hoses - there was NO aiming for individual targets, only a relatively large, open area. SECOND, he had 60- and 100-round magazines. Even with just 60-rounders, he'd have had to swap mags only 8 times to get off 500 shots. 15-20 minutes, when your cyclic rate of fire is roughly 400-500 rounds/minute, and a mag swap takes MAYBE 10 seconds, is absurd. THIRD, he apparently had about a dozen semi-auto/bump-fire modified rifles - which anyone who was even a LITTLE sensible and who engaged in a LITTLE planning (and he engaged in a LOT of planning) would have had ready with fully-loaded 60- or 100-round mags (and, by all reports, this is EXACTLY what he did). Thus, NO MAG SWAPS NEEDED for the first dozen or so fusillades, reducing the time necessary to get off 500 shots. FYI, I think that he fired off many more than 500 rounds - after all, roughly 600 separate people were either wounded or killed. We're probably looking at 1,500 shots, minimum - ALL of which were quite possible in 10-12 minutes with FA firing and very large magazines.
8. That whole paragraph regarding sighting in and practicing with a .308 bolt-action rifle with a scope is pretty much irrelevant. He was firing FA/simulated FA, and DID NOT NEED TO AIM. FA weapons are bullet hoses, intended to deny an area to enemy troops. You use the same technique to hose down an area with a FA weapon that firemen use to hose down a large fire - gradual sweeping of the area from one side to the other...NO AIMING REQUIRED, except to be in the general area of the large target.
Again, there are a LOT of questions - starting with "Why does a 64-year-old retired accountant become a mass-murderer?" There are also a lot of questions about the weapons used, the number of bullets fired, the amount of time involved in firing, etc., etc. I'm NOT saying that there was a 2nd shooter, NOR am I saying that there WASN'T - we have to have more information (which the police/FBI may/should already have) in order to reach any conclusion (or to call BS on the conclusions that the investigators give us).
My discussion above regarding the list of objections you quoted shows that whoever wrote them has no clue as to what happened, nor about the nature of this murder spree, nor about how weapons operate.
Initial reports are often right, before they are sanitized.
See the video in post #43.
Where is your SARC tag?
I read here that historically in wars, about one-third of soldiers hit by bullets die as a result. Those numbers are now down to 15-20% probably due to body armor. https://atwar.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/08/19/why-do-bullets-kill-more-soldiers-in-iraq/ Prior to the recent conflicts, most soldiers’ body armor consisted only of a helmet (plus perhaps a flack jacket that was not designed to stop bullets). So to kill 58 people, the shooter had to hit something like 174 people at 300+ yards. No helmets so maybe a bit fewer. The people were packed in there but that is still a lot of people to hit. I am guessing he had to have zeroed his weapons (with the scopes) and had to have practiced on them, so somebody would have seen him on a range etc. (Unless he was more experienced with weapons than has been reported so far) This is just my two cents FWIW
Lower floor windows supposedly open.
There were an estimated 22,000 people in the crowd.
Simply firing high-powered rounds toward the center of the crowd could easily hit 500 people. Some shots probably hit more than one person at first. Simply spraying the crowd is all he needed, no need to have to aim. THe crowd “scattered”, but a crowd of standing-room only people don’t really scatter, they mostly push each other to the ground, and being on the ground is no defense when the shooter is 32 stories high.
I would be surprised if even half of his shots missed targets in that environment.
The day is not over yet.
Careful, you dare question the great TigerClaws and you get labeled a liberal Media Matters troll with a low IQ.
He’s infallible and the king of all investigations.
The suite was right next to a stairwell. We don’t know if anyone left the suite, the Sheriff said last night that the door was open.
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