Posted on 05/20/2011 5:24:45 PM PDT by bibletruth
Magisterium will NEVER replace the higher teaching ministry of the HOLY SPIRIT...The GodHead...The WORD.
Through God, I am sanctified; I am justified; I have the promise of future glorification; I am a child of God; I am a son of God. My God teaches my soul correct Bible doctrines because the entire Godhead indwells my soul. I am are declared a son of God in Romans 8:14-15.
Correct, but, unlike Hebrew, the koine Greek did not use a special name for the divine lord. Hence the misunderstanding of Psalm 110.1. The second Hebrew word for "lord" (adown) in that verse is exclusively used for secular princes and not as a divine title, so it couldn't possibly be referring to Jesus. In LXX (actually Ps 109.1) the Greek does not differentiate Yahweh from kyrios, as the Hebrew does: τῷ Δαυιδ ψαλμός εἶπεν ὁ κύριος τῷ κυρίῳ μου...
But whose Greek would that be??? I'm thinking some of the scholars out there may disagree with you...
I see your point. Sorry for misunderstanding. Jews and Christians can argue theology but not beliefs, since the Jews reject the Christian God en toto, just as the Christians reject the Hindu or the Mormon god. JH reject Christ's divinity and therefore their beliefs are incompatible with Christian beliefs, but that doesn't mean they can't argue why they believe what they believe.
Likewise, Baptists and Catholics can discuss the merits of baptism but not their beliefs on the subject, as they are incompatible. I think the whole purpose of the religion forum is to allow everyone to state why they believe what they believe and not whose God is true. Otherwise there will be no discussion. :)
So, the limit is when the discusisonr reaches the level of belief.
More important is the fact that the cathodic dogma is not what was believed everywhere and always. Possibly there was a group who did believe it all along, but that is not evident from the Bible or the early (second and third century) Church Fathers and Christian apologetics.
Nope...The theme of the Bible is the Kingdom...The Jewish Kingdom...
Thruout the OT God's focus in on his chosen people, the Jews...NOT, the salvation of mankind...
In the NT, same thing...
God became a Jewish man to minister to the Jews...
Only after the Jews rejected Jesus did he turn to us Gentiles...And that was only to make his chosen people jealous, for a time...
When God is done letting the Jews learn their lesson, he will take us Gentiles out of the way by way of the Rapture and will again turn to his chosen, the Jews...
The theme of the Bible is not salvation for mankind...
Your comment about picking up a bible, reading it from Genesis to Revelation and staying within the context is way, way over the top...Or way under the bottom...
Other than a nice story, the scriptures apparently are meaningless to your religion...It's apparent that's why your religion could not write a commentary on the scriptures, just a handful of scriptures taken out of context and put into your catechism...
So what are you saying? Are you saying that proper names are normally accompanied by the definite article?
Are you saying that John, a monotheistic Jew, intended by this to refer to a ‘lesser’ god, not to be confused with the True God he had just mentioned?
Cordially,
NO, I was actually agreeing with you, and should have included cyc and cronos in the reply. Sorry:(
“Senile”? That’s very classy.
Thank you for sharing your beliefs
Rom 11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
My beliefs and God's...But you don't believe it, eh???
Here is the one speaking in Psalm 82:
“God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.”
What those judges think of themselves isn't mentioned, in fact, it would be irrelevant as they termed “gods”.
Even Moses was called a god. (Ex.4:16)
“John never said “a god”, he said “the Word (Jesus) was God”, not “a” god”
John did not write in English. He wrote in Greek. Greek is not English. It is different. It uses different rules of grammar. I've explained three of those rules/practices that are pertinent to John 1:1.
If you missed them I can will repeat them. Shall I do so?
“Now, since we believe in ONE God, hence Jesus Christ was/is God.”
Then translating into English as nearly as possible what John wrote in Greek would not change that and there is thus no reason to not have a translation most accurate and faithful to the words and meaning of John as possible.
“John never said “a god”, he said “the Word (Jesus) was God”, not “a” god”
You referred to Psalm 82 at the beginning of your comment, saying:
“Firstly, in the psalms, it clearly says that the judges may think of themselves as gods but they die like men”
I'm sure you agree Jesus quoted that Psalm correctly, and in writing John recorded Jesus’ words as, “I said, ‘Gods (with a capital letter in Greek)) you are’.
How could these judges be Gods? They couldn't and so translators use the proper English equivalent, “gods” for the Greek “Gods” and rearrange the words accordingly.
I must decline your offer as keeping up with my own typos is enough.
In Greek, yes. It's ο θεος (the God), η ζων (the Life), το φως (the Light), ο λογοσ (the Word), etc.
There is no indefinite article. The equivalent of the English indefinite article a/any in Greek is the absence of it! Thus, λογος is a or any word, and κυριος is a or any lord.
I don't make the rules, and I don't spin.
Are you saying that John, a monotheistic Jew, intended by this to refer to a ‘lesser’ god, not to be confused with the True God he had just mentioned?
"John" was not one but many. John's Gospel, as we know it, is a highly interpolated late first century and highly Hellenized multi-author work that is neither expicitly Trinitarian nor monotheistic. As for being "lesser" that God, that is in John's Gospel as well (cf John 14:28)
Ok, got it. :)
Didn’t mean to hurt your feelings, old boy, just don’t like being bullied and bossed, never did, never did ‘specially by those who are guests here like everyone else.
Just can’t go it at all, you see.
The word used for God and gods is the same elohiym, meaning the judges. What differentiates the first elohiym (the Judge, God) from the judges are the accent marks. It is God who is called the Judge (in the royal plural) who is judging the judges, or rulers, not gods in the divine sense.
A similar difference is seen in the derivative of the word 'adown meaning master. In the special plural, marked by a short accent, it stands for the Lord God (Adonai), but in the regular plural adonai it stands for masters. Thus, in Ps 110.1 the second lord in the English translation is 'adown, which is never used for God (because it is in singular).
All divine names in Hebrew are in plural (to denote the innumerable majesties of God), carefully distinguished form secular titles derived form the same root. For that reason Ps 110.1 is not about Jesus as the Church insists.
None of these distinctions are distinguished in the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible. We must be cautions when using the English translations where words 'god' appears.
The KJV, in this case translates not from Hebrew but from LXX "Ὁ θεὸς ἔστη ἐν συναγωγῇ θεῶν..." [Ps 81:1 in the Greek OT]... "God is in the congregation [synagogue] of the gods [i.e. mighty ones)..." Thus, the word "gods" is of the Greek origin and not in the original Hebrew.
Bullying? I try to be reasonable and elabporate what I say. Family and profession are not part of this forum. Beliefs are. It can't get and more reasonable than that. It's a belief forum! You know my beliefs, so you know where I am coming from. If we are all the same (guests, as you say) what makes you exempt?
Guy, the oldest Greek manuscripts did not have lower case letters, so everything was CAPITALIZED
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