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To: bronx2
In 1971 somebody turned me on to to Meister Eckhart. Somewhere he says that obedience to the prelate is obedience to God.

Clearly he did not mean that the prelate was invariably good, wise or correct. The whole Dominican polity and rule assumes that prelates will usually be inadequate, which is why the ethos of the order is so democratic.

But, IF we dare to believe the promise that the gates of hell will not prevail against the Church and if we believe the pledges made to the apostles (and understand them as the Catholic Church does) then it makes sense.

That's datum #1. Datum #2 is personal, private confession. We are challenged to act as if we REALLY believe that the most important thing about us is not our sinfulness but the love and forgiveness of Jesus. If I really believe that, the shame that hinders my going to confession will not succeed in preventing me.

To obey the prelate, especially when s/he is a dweeb, to confess some disgraceful act -- all these are to ACT on the belief that the most important thing is not MY opinion or MY esteem in the eyes of others, but God's promises and His forgiveness.

Even if there were no real grace given in confession, it would still be a good thing to do because of the "natural" benefits. And when my superiors (they don't have MUCH power over me) are clearly doing the wrong thing, to acquiesce is to say that I trust God to make it come out all right, AND that He will give me the grace to love them in any case.

In other words, to really DO Catholicism is just to practice the Gospel, to practice trusting God, to practice handing even our "conceit of ourselves" over to Him.

It is no more about MY precious vision, MY perceptive understanding, MY general excellence. Even if my spiritual eyes are put out, my shame is made public, my abilities are taken away, even if GOD hands me over to ecclesiastical idiots, poltroons, and buffoons, still HIS will will be done, because He promised it would, and when the compost hits the air conditioner, all I have is His promise.

There are days, weeks, when being Catholic seems to mean nothing but frustration, embarrassment, and the taxing of my patience beyond its limits.

THEREFORE I am glad to be in full communion with the Church. Maybe one day, at last, I will be humble, obedient, and patient -- as my sweet Lord was.

1,175 posted on 09/02/2010 5:26:16 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Mad Dawg; TSgt; RnMomof7; Alex Murphy; HarleyD; wmfights; Forest Keeper; the_conscience; ...
In 1971 somebody turned me on to to Meister Eckhart. Somewhere he says that obedience to the prelate is obedience to God.

And right there is what is so wrong with the papacy and where Roman Catholics err in their understanding of whom Christians are called to obey.

We do not serve the church. The church serves us.

No wonder Rome is mired in endless scandals committed by "another Christ."

"If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour." -- John 12:26

1,181 posted on 09/02/2010 6:44:31 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg (("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Mad Dawg

There’s a LOT in the attitudes in that post which I can certainly agree with on principle . . . though not, per se, to the structure you involve.


1,186 posted on 09/02/2010 7:36:28 PM PDT by Quix (C THE PLAN of the Bosses: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2519352/posts?page=2#2)
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To: Mad Dawg

Mad Dawg wrote:
“In 1971 somebody turned me on to to Meister Eckhart.”

Yes, well, you’d better watch out. Sometime before 1517 someone turned Martin Luther on to Meister Eckhart. (and, no, I am not kidding) Look where that ended up.


1,196 posted on 09/02/2010 7:56:16 PM PDT by Belteshazzar
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