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To: Antoninus
"Jesus also clearly calls her “Woman”, now I have never called my mother “woman”, and I never will.

He did that for a reason...

Remember things get lost in translation. Actually the Greek word tranlated "Woman" in English is a respectful & endearing word--quite different than if you said "Woman!" to your mother...

None-the-less, of course the wedding at Cana doesn't prove we should try to pray to Mary or any other persons whose souls are in Heaven.

You Roman Catholics should concede the point: No where in the bible are there examples of persons on earth praying to persons in Heaven. And prayer is ALWAYS a form of worship.

This is why prayers to idols were seen as so wrong, as PRAYER IS WORSHIP, not merely respect and veneration.

An all knowing nature is reserved to God alone--and once again, there is no evidence somehow people in Heaven change their nature and share God's omniscience. Hence neither Mary, nor anyone else in Heaven other than God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, is always able to hear you pray.

Only one example exists of communication with the godly dead, and that was the evil King Saul communicating with the soul of the dead prophet Samuel, through the conjuring of a witch. (1 Samuel 28:3–25)

If you want to follow that example--because your Church (which has been wrong before...) tells you to, in contrast to Holy Scripture, I won't stop you, but be aware in Old Testament days conjuring the dead was a death penalty offense.

If Mary were so important to give high veneration to--including the worship of prayer, the fact must have been lost on Saint Paul and Saint Peter--both of whom never mention her in their writings. And of course Paul's letters make up more than 1/3 of the New Testament--and with Peter I would think you would pay attention to your first 'pope...'

1,344 posted on 06/02/2008 9:26:00 PM PDT by AnalogReigns ( Quinque Solor!)
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To: AnalogReigns

Amen! It gets back the question of “Why does the RCC make such a BIG DEAL about Mary? Is Jesus simply not enough for them?”


1,384 posted on 06/03/2008 5:47:19 AM PDT by Manfred the Wonder Dawg (Test ALL things, hold to that which is True.)
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To: AnalogReigns
You Roman Catholics should concede the point: No where in the bible are there examples of persons on earth praying to persons in Heaven. And prayer is ALWAYS a form of worship.

This is why prayers to idols were seen as so wrong, as PRAYER IS WORSHIP, not merely respect and veneration.

AMEN! It could not be clearer.

1,398 posted on 06/03/2008 6:29:58 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: AnalogReigns
And prayer is ALWAYS a form of worship.

I see. So when a homeless guy asks me for change, he's worshiping me? Is that it?

You folks have perverted the meaning of the word "prayer" so that it fits your bigotry. Prayer is not a form of worship. It's a form of humility. There is no difference between humbly begging your brother who is alive on earth to pray for you than there is humbly begging St. Peter, St. Paul, St. Andrew, St. Therese, or St. Bernadette, all of whom are alive in Heaven, to pray for you. It seems that for many Protestants, humility before God, His angels and His saints is not in the playbook at all.

1,410 posted on 06/03/2008 7:11:40 AM PDT by Antoninus (John 6:54)
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