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To: Gamecock

“we also agree that the other is saved by Grace through Faith in Christ. “

*smiles* Fantastic! We Catholics believe the same thing!

Pope of Vatican I, Pius IX
Quanto conficiamur moerore of 10 August, 1863

“those who observe carefully the natural law, and the precepts graven by God upon the hearts of all men, and who being disposed to obey God lead an honest and upright life, may, aided by the light of divine grace, attain to eternal life; for God who sees clearly, searches and knows the heart, the disposition, the thoughts and intentions of each, in His supreme mercy and goodness by no means permits that anyone suffer eternal punishment”


472 posted on 04/07/2008 12:52:44 AM PDT by Chantillie ("Sit vis nobiscum")
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To: Chantillie
Ahhh, but that is not the definition of faith/grace. That quote is loaded with works, for instance who being disposed to obey God lead an honest and upright life.

Romans teaches all have fallen short, there are none righteous, no, not one.

We rely on the one who did the perfect work, and then on the cross took the sins of who believe, and transferred that righteousness onto us.

473 posted on 04/07/2008 1:21:22 AM PDT by Gamecock (Viva La Reformacion!)
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To: Chantillie; Gamecock; Alex Murphy; wmfights
Hi! Welcome to FR.

Pope of Vatican I, Pius IX Quanto conficiamur moerore of 10 August, 1863

"those who observe carefully the natural law, and the precepts graven by God upon the hearts of all men..."

Most Protestants do not believe "natural law" saves anyone. Christ on the cross saves His flock.

The law serves to condemn us by showing how we cannot obey perfectly. Only Christ's obedience saves the fallen sinner by grace.

"For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous." -- Romans 5:19

Knowing this, however, does not restrict God. God works in mysterious ways, and He can give a new heart to anyone He wants whenever He wants.

But natural law is like natural man who "receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned."

479 posted on 04/07/2008 5:39:13 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Chantillie
“those who observe carefully the natural law, and the precepts graven by God upon the hearts of all men, and who being disposed to obey God lead an honest and upright life, may, aided by the light of divine grace, attain to eternal life; for God who sees clearly, searches and knows the heart, the disposition, the thoughts and intentions of each, in His supreme mercy and goodness by no means permits that anyone suffer eternal punishment”

That is the heresy of Universalism.

See no man is saved unless they believe in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. (Acts 4:12)

577 posted on 04/07/2008 2:21:59 PM PDT by fortheDeclaration ("Our constitution was made only for a moral and religious people".-John Adams)
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