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To: HarleyD; Kolokotronis; jo kus
I'm talking about those beliefs where there is considerable disagreement, like original sin, that has been established from the "chair of Peter"

The Orthodox Church does not deny the original (ancestral) sin — the sin of Adam and Eve. The Orthodox Church, and I believe the Roman Catholic Church, believes that we do not inherit their sin (i.e. guilt) but only propensity to sin — a defective nature that tends to sin as a result of ancestral sin.

I believe St. Augustine's choice of words the, "original sin," was an unfortunate mistake because it serves as the basis for the Reformed theology of total depravity which the Church never taught. Again, only the fallen angels are dead in sin; there is no salvation for them.

If every local Orthodox church is free to formulate their own local doctrinal position, as has been stated, you could have far more than 33,000 different "Churches" each running around saying all sorts of things

I am not sure where this comes from, perhaps something Kolokotronis wrote but I am sure he will be the first to correct himself by saying that this is not true. Church Fathers were free to hypothesize and propose qeologoumena [theologoumena], or "religious opinion," which in no way represent Church doctrine. If you want to know what the Church doctrine is read the Ecumenical Councils. If it was not proclaimed by a Council it is not the doctrine of the entire Church.

Individual Churches may have certain theological ideas, for example, the Russian toll-houses which are faintly reminiscent of the Purgatory, and not shared by other Orthodox Churches, but all Orthodox Churches believe that the soul of the departed is subjected to an "interim period" of waiting, knowing that it is destined either to hell or to bliss, without going into speculative details of this "place" where the souls are.

So, to say outright that the Purgatory is wrong is wrong, but we can question the details of the Latin teaching, as we question the teaching of "transubstantiation" yet we at no time doubt that it expresses the very same faith we hold — that the bread and wine do become the Body and Blood of Christ; as to how this happens, the Orthodox simply leave it to that favorite of yours, a "Mystery of God".

Luther held a low view of James, just like many of the Church such as Eusebius and Jerome

The devil is in the details, HD. Why did they hold such a low view of an Apostle (the book of James was not a disputed book to the best of my knowledge); what were their reasons. With Luther, it clashed directly with his entire theology of a "dead faith."

7,781 posted on 06/05/2006 11:09:48 AM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50
The Orthodox Church does not deny the original (ancestral) sin — the sin of Adam and Eve. The Orthodox Church, and I believe the Roman Catholic Church, believes that we do not inherit their sin (i.e. guilt) but only propensity to sin — a defective nature that tends to sin as a result of ancestral sin.

It is my understanding that the Catholic Church teaches original sin, that is to say we are guilty for what Adam and Eve did. If that isn't the case, I am sure a Catholic on the thread will correct that statement.

I believe St. Augustine's choice of words the, "original sin," was an unfortunate mistake because it serves as the basis for the Reformed theology of total depravity which the Church never taught. Again, only the fallen angels are dead in sin; there is no salvation for them.

The vast majority of Protestants do believe in original sin, but not total depravity. A belief in total depravity does not follow necessarily from the idea of original sin. Calvinist-Reformed thinking did go in that direction, but the vast majority of Protestants are not Reformed.

7,783 posted on 06/05/2006 11:38:37 AM PDT by stripes1776
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