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Warplanes attack Basra column
BBC ^ | 3/26/2003 18:24 GMT | Clive Myrie

Posted on 03/26/2003 10:33:26 AM PST by Forgiven_Sinner

British troops are in position around Basra

Coalition warplanes are attacking a huge convoy of tanks and armoured personnel carriers which are heading south-east from Basra towards the al-Faw peninsula.

BBC correspondent Clive Myrie is close to the area and says the battle has been raging for more than an hour.

He says the movement of Iraqi armour may be a counter-attack to recapture ground lost over the last two or three days, or possibly a tactical retreat from Basra because of the possibility of an uprising in the north of the city.

British radar spotted the column of between 70 and 120 vehicles following the coast road along the Shatt al-Arab waterway and a number of fighter jets were scrambled to engage the column.

British troops are positioned along the coast road as well as around Basra, amid reports of an uprising in the city. Those reports have been dismissed by the Iraqis.

Earlier, 14 civilians died and another 30 were injured in Baghdad when a shopping area was hit during an air raid by US-led coalition forces, the Iraqi authorities say.

The BBC's Andrew Gilligan, at the scene in the northern Shaab district of the city, says it appears that two missiles hit a busy parade of shops, several hundred metres from any military buildings.

An angry crowd of several hundred people gathered in the area following the strike, waving the shoes and clothes of victims.

If confirmed as a coalition attack, correspondents say it will be a blow to attempts by the US-led forces to minimise civilian casualties during their drive to unseat Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein.

Key military developments

* Republican Guard units in the outskirts of Baghdad continue to be bombed

* Coalition forces fire intense artillery barrages towards the city of Nasiriya - about 370 kilometres (230 miles) south-east of Baghdad

British forces continue to report surprise resistance in Basra, which they had hoped would welcome them.

They said most resistance came from paramilitaries loyal to Saddam Hussein, using guerrilla tactics inside the city, rather than from the regular army.

But UK troops have been reluctant to enter the city aggressively to combat the paramilitaries, because of the risk to civilians.

IRAQ CAMPAIGN

Map: Military operations Iraq's Republican Guard

They have been halted again - this time at the town of Ash Shatrah, about 40 km north of the city of Nasiriya.

The Marines responded by calling in artillery strikes on Iraqi positions in the town.

The Iraqis say that about 200 houses in the city have been destroyed, and about 500 people wounded.

Further north, the US 7thCavalry has been involved in the largest battle of the war so far, near the central town of Najaf.

An American intelligence officer has said that up to 650 Iraqis who attacked the armoured column were killed.

That contrasts with an earlier estimate by the Pentagon of between 150 and 300 Iraqi dead.

In other developments:

* A large convoy of Republican Guards is reported to be moving south of Baghdad for what could be a major confrontation with coalition forces, Associated Press news agency says

Iraqis vow revenge after the blasts An angry crowd gathered at the scene * The US is sending another 30,000 troops to join the campaign in Iraq

* Arabic television channel al-Jazeera broadcasts a video of what it said was two dead British soldiers and two British prisoners of war

* US President George W Bush speaks of "steady progress" in the war and warns the Iraqi leadership that the "day of reckoning" is getting nearer. Mr Bush is to meet UK Prime Minister Tony Blair on Wednesday to discuss the immediate future of Iraq if Saddam Hussein is deposed


TOPICS: Breaking News; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: aircraft; armor; basra; battle; cas; highwayofdeath; iraq; turkeyshoot
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To: js1138
Civilian targets always have been and always will be the primary target in all wars. Just look back on history.

For those of you who get teary-eyed over this, you are not cut out for war, and are doomed to be the oppressed.

We wouldn’t have won the war against Germany or Japan without bombing cities. Hell, we wouldn’t have even won the recient war against the Serbs.

141 posted on 03/26/2003 12:13:12 PM PST by babygene (Viable after 87 trimesters)
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To: Paulus Invictus
I've seen live fire demos of A-10's. When the gatling gun is fired, the recoil stops the plane's forward motion momentarily.
142 posted on 03/26/2003 12:16:14 PM PST by CholeraJoe (OO-OOH Can't anybody see? We've got a war to fight.)
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To: babygene
I can't recall a war we've won since 1945 where we didn't try to limit civilian casulties.
143 posted on 03/26/2003 12:18:38 PM PST by js1138
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To: Doctor Stochastic
I strongly disagree with your characterization of the post you take issue with. The poster did not take glee in a report of civilian casualties. He said he did not particularly care about them. Personally, I think the issue of civilian casualties is being way overblown. They seem to be remarkably low given what is happening. Here is the lead paragraph from an AP story today:

A large contingent of Iraq's Republican Guard headed south under cover of blinding sandstorms in a 1,000-vehicle convoy Wednesday toward central Iraq — site of the heaviest fighting of the war. In Baghdad, Iraqi officials said two cruise missiles hit a residential area, killing 14 people.

The sentence relating to the Iraqi claim does not belong at the top of the story. The information should be down in the story and it should characterize the Iraqi statement as a 'claim' or 'allegation'. The reporter should have also noted that the U.S. had not confirmed the claim. In fact, the U.S. military says the market was not near any of our targets. This event may have been from AAA fire or even an Iraqi plot.

Bottom line-- the press tries to promote the issue of civilian casualties as of paramount importance. It is wrong to do so.

144 posted on 03/26/2003 12:19:07 PM PST by San Jacinto
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To: Blood of Tyrants
I hope they haven't loaded up the vehicles with civilians and had a few future martyrs drive them out to be slaughtered.

I was thinking the same thing myself, but then again, it would be hard for them to say we were deliberately targeting civilians, when we were actually destroying armored forces.

145 posted on 03/26/2003 12:21:49 PM PST by Mark17
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To: Coop
You are correct. The use of a airliner (in all attacks) was terrorism. Targeting the Pentagon per se was not. (I got this from a government lawyer.)
146 posted on 03/26/2003 12:22:33 PM PST by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: johnb838
Your post was not well thought out to me. I was talking about the attempts at a counter attack. Even when playing dirty-many Iraqis are fighting back. Saying the Iraqis aren't fighting fair has no bearing on this fact.
147 posted on 03/26/2003 12:25:50 PM PST by Destro (Fight Islamic terrorisim by visiting www.johnathangaltfilms.com)
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To: okchemyst
Personally, I'd like to see about a million Iraqis (soldiers or civilians, makes no diff. to me) as shadow silhouettes against the ruins of Baghdad like the aftermath of Hiroshima. Kill them all.

Your comments seem to justify the French and German views about Americans as bloodthirsty killers. Extermination, not liberation.

148 posted on 03/26/2003 12:26:47 PM PST by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: Darksheare
No, the attacks on the World Trade Center were not acts of war. They were clearly terrorism. It makes a difference in whether we shoot or hang the perpetrators. (See the Major André case.)
149 posted on 03/26/2003 12:29:12 PM PST by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: js1138
Good point! We haven’t WON any wars since 1945... (Maybe you’re talking about Viet Nam or Korea) Only possible exception was Serbia. Remember, in Serbia we bombed the hell out of civilians)
150 posted on 03/26/2003 12:29:52 PM PST by babygene (Viable after 87 trimesters)
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To: piasa
Exactly. As are those wearing US uniforms.
151 posted on 03/26/2003 12:30:32 PM PST by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
The attack on the WTC was also an attack on our financial district which is an overt act of war.
Don't argue with a former soldier, son.
152 posted on 03/26/2003 12:30:35 PM PST by Darksheare (Nox aeternus en pax.)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
Actually, I don't give a damned what you think. If I feel that way or what. So, stick it.
153 posted on 03/26/2003 12:32:22 PM PST by RetiredArmy
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To: RetiredArmy
the Doc:
No, the attacks on the World Trade Center were not acts of war. They were clearly terrorism. It makes a difference in whether we shoot or hang the perpetrators. (See the Major André case.)

Myself:
The attack on the WTC was also an attack on our financial district which is an overt act of war.
Don't argue with a former soldier, son.
154 posted on 03/26/2003 12:34:21 PM PST by Darksheare (Nox aeternus en pax.)
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To: RightWhale
"Headed southeast? Perhaps trying to get to the border and into Iran. Makes no sense otherwise, since they are moving away from Baghdad and away from resupply."

I read that and am confused too.

155 posted on 03/26/2003 12:35:02 PM PST by blam
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To: babygene
Good point! We haven’t WON any wars since 1945...

Your knowledge of history is breathtaking.

156 posted on 03/26/2003 12:39:22 PM PST by js1138
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To: js1138
"Your knowledge of history is breathtaking."

To a fifth grader like yourself, I suppose so...
157 posted on 03/26/2003 12:43:54 PM PST by babygene (Viable after 87 trimesters)
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To: RetiredArmy
If confirmed as a coalition attack, correspondents say it will be a blow to attempts by the US-led forces to minimise civilian casualties during their drive to unseat Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein.

I think that expectations have not been managed properly. If these casualties were caused by the coalition, it should have been understood by the media, the U.S. public, and the world, that some civilians would die.

This is, after all, a criminal regime. They rely on the fact that we are not willing to cause great civilian casualties to protect their forces. We have advised the Iraqi civilians to remain in their residences (though not loudly enough) partially for that reason.

We cannot be percieved as successful even in victory, if the standard of "success" is that we fight a war where no one dies.

158 posted on 03/26/2003 12:54:10 PM PST by SoulStorms
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To: COBOL2Java
You cleaned it up nicely,I suspect.Love the quote.
159 posted on 03/26/2003 1:00:15 PM PST by MEG33
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To: SoulStorms
I would add the amount of civilians we have killed is incredibly low. Anybody who thinks that it's a lot is forgetting just how far we have come when it comes to war.

If I heard this right, the Iraqis killed were at some kind of mall, outdoor or otherwise. If so, what in the heck were people doing shopping in the middle of a raid.

160 posted on 03/26/2003 1:00:47 PM PST by af_vet_rr
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