Police Seize Home Arsenal Fire Alerts Authorities to Nearly 500 (legal) Weapons

The Asbury Park Press ^ | 12-03-02 | Michael Clancy

[Iron Eagle]

Published in the Asbury Park Press 12/03/02 Fire alerts authorities to nearly 500 weapons By MICHAEL CLANCY STAFF WRITER FAIR HAVEN -- Three dump trucks removed an arsenal of live ammunition and almost 500 weapons -- all of them apparently held legally -- which police found in a home after the fire department responded to a chimney fire and the homeowner threatened the fire chief with a rifle, authorities said yesterday.

[DAnconia55]

The Fire Chief has the backing of law that has passed Constitutional muster to remove civilians from danger and to prevent civilians from interfering with the efforts of firefighters to carry out their obligations.

The law once also allowed for Slavery.
Just because something is law does not 1) make it morally correct, 2) make it Constitutional.

[DAnconia55]

Are you willing to take the consequences of defying a Fire Chief? Are you willing to respect the Constitutional authority of the district attorney, the judge and jury who will decide whether or not you are guilty of breaking the law that is on the books if you choose to break the law against interfering with the fire department's duties? True believers of the Constitution respect the law, and are willing to take the consequences when they choose to break it.

Yes. No. And Incorrect.

We have a duty to disregard law that violates our Rights, or the Constitution.

[Catspaw]

What is required for firemen to take control of a scene? In the three scenarios I mentioned above, should firemen have taken over the scenes and evacuated the buildings?

It's up to the judgment of the firefighters. Are you saying that others besides firefighters should be the ones to determine what the firefighters should and can do?

[Catspaw]

The moral crime with child porn lies in the taking of the photograph, which a child cannot consent to.

Ah, a true libertarian. It's illegal to take the picture, but it's not illegal to slobber over the pictures of a four-year-old in a sex act.

[wimpycat]

We have a duty to disregard law that violates our Rights, or the Constitution.

And just who determines what laws violate our rights? The Constitutional process, not Joe Schmoe waving a gun at the Fire Chief. Of course, if you choose to disregard the law, as a respecter of the Constitution, you will, I'm sure, show up for your trial, assuming you posted bail, where you have the right to confront the witnesses against you, etc. That's the remedy mandated by the Constitution to resolve disputes of this nature.

BTW, do you pay all your taxes and parking tickets and the like? Or did you decide they were un-Constitutional?

[supercat]

It's up to the judgment of the firefighters. Are you saying that others besides firefighters should be the ones to determine what the firefighters should and can do?

Well, there must be some sort of standards. Even if the firefighter on scene has the authority to determine whether the standards are met, there must be some provision indicating when it's appropriate to take a scene (with provisions for punishing firefighters who take over scenes when it's grossly inappropriate to do so). If not, firefighters have just as much power as the KGB.

[wimpycat]

It's up to the judgment of the firefighters.

And if someone has a problem with the firefighters' judgement, they can take them to court...not assault them or threaten them with weapons.

[Catspaw]

We have a Police and Fire Commission that oversees the police and fire department. If you have one, that's where you'll find their code of conduct. Or if you know a city councilman or county supervisor, they can give you or tell you where you can find the firefighter's code of conduct. Or talk to the fire commissioner, the fire chief or ranking officer (assistant chief, captain) and find out what goes into their assessment of a fire scene. The basics of their training is fairly standard, so it wouldn't vary too much from department to department.

[tpaine]

Your delight in imagining that slobbering person is evident. - Get help.

[edsheppa]

An arsenal is a factory where weapons are made.

Nope.

[Catspaw]

pain, you're getting a little cranky. Your kiddy porn collection must be running low. I know DAnconia55 can lend you some of his.

[Ben Bolt]

I've read mine more than several times prior to taking the loan and indeed after signing it . Most of what I see is a promise of security & the demand I do business with several other taxpayer socialized codependant business's.

On the other hand I do keep my money because doing so I empower myself and my family wich I do legally and ethically . This allows us to compliment my neighborhood 1st .

Not the collective FedGov . They have enough .

[Catspaw]

We shall see fruitloop, when, and if, -- this case comes to court. I doubt it will. Odds are the 'authorities' will settle out of court, rather than risk further embarrassment. - After all, tax money will pay for their excessive zeal.

You don't settle out of court in a criminal case (you're confusing criminal and civil cases) and that's what your boy is facing. He's going to have to resolve these charges, and knowing prosecutors, they're not willing to drop charges against anybody. They will, of course, plea bargain. If your boy doesn't like the plea bargain, he can go to trial, and then it's up to the jury to decide his guilt or innocence. The jury may not convict, but a jury verdict of not guilty runs at a very low percentage to guilty verdicts. Then--if he's acquitted--he can file a civil suit and see if he gets a settlement offer. They township may decide to fight it, and if that's the case, these cases take years before it even gets a trial date. It's going to be years before he sees daylight, much less any money from the township. In the meantime, he's going to be out a ton of money for legal fees.

[Catspaw]

I've read mine more than several times prior to taking the loan and indeed after signing it . Most of what I see is a promise of security & the demand I do business with several other taxpayer socialized codependant business's.

You're talking about your mortgage. I'm talking about a homeowner's insurance policy. They're two different things.

[tpaine]

To: Catspaw
Your delight in imagining that slobbering person is evident. - Get help.
370 posted by tpaine


To: tpaine; DAnconia55
pain, you're getting a little cranky. Your kiddy porn collection must be running low. I know DAnconia55 can lend you some of his.
372

You're completey out of line suggesting that I and DA55 are kiddy porn collectors.
-- As I said above, your mental probems are becoming quite evident. -- I'd suggest you watch your lying mouth. - Or take your crap to the backroom.

[Catspaw]

Touchy, touchy, pain. Have I hit a nerve?

[tpaine]

We shall see fruitloop, when, and if, -- this case comes to court. I doubt it will. Odds are the 'authorities' will settle out of court, rather than risk further embarrassment. - After all, tax money will pay for their excessive zeal.

You don't settle out of court in a criminal case (you're confusing criminal and civil cases) and that's what your boy is facing.

He's not 'my boy'.
And I have reasonable doubt, from the account, that he will face a criminal case.

He's going to have to resolve these charges, and knowing prosecutors, they're not willing to drop charges against anybody. They will, of course, plea bargain. If your boy doesn't like the plea bargain, he can go to trial, and then it's up to the jury to decide his guilt or innocence. The jury may not convict, but a jury verdict of not guilty runs at a very low percentage to guilty verdicts.

I see now, -- you are a foremost authority on the criminal justice system in this area of New Jersey. - Sure. -- How amusing.

Then--if he's acquitted--he can file a civil suit and see if he gets a settlement offer. They township may decide to fight it, and if that's the case, these cases take years before it even gets a trial date. It's going to be years before he sees daylight, much less any money from the township. In the meantime, he's going to be out a ton of money for legal fees.

Yep, you know it all, 'cat'. Or at least you are convinced of that delusion. - Thanks.

[tpaine]

"Have I hit a nerve?"


Not at all 'cat'. Please continue making a fool of yourself.

[philetus]

Mistake #1:threatened the fire chief with a rifle

That was a very stupid move.

If convicted (and I believe he will be) he won't get anything back and he won't be able to buy any more.