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Confession Had His Signature; DNA Did Not
Nytimes.com ^ | August 26, 2002 | JODI WILGOREN

Posted on 08/28/2002 8:25:05 PM PDT by 2sheep

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More government corruption.

 Truth in Justice ~~~ "Truth in Justice is a non-profit organization working to free wholly innocent men and women convicted of crimes they did not commit, and to prevent wrongful convictions by educating the public regarding the vulnerabilities in the U. S. criminal justice system that make these miscarriages possible."

 The world’s least-free country

1 posted on 08/28/2002 8:25:05 PM PDT by 2sheep
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To: Prodigal Daughter; Thinkin' Gal; Jeremiah Jr; babylonian; Fred Mertz; American in Israel; ...
BTTT
2 posted on 08/28/2002 8:26:47 PM PDT by 2sheep
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To: 2sheep
Saw this poor specimen on O'Reilly tonight. The lights are on but no one's home. If he hadn't been in jail he should have spent the time in an institution getting the help he so clearly needs.
In systems and processes created by the hand and mind of man, mistakes, and the ability to make them, will always be part of the equation. If we waited for perfection, Abel's murder would be Numero Uno in the old Cold Case File.
3 posted on 08/28/2002 8:31:13 PM PDT by thegreatbeast
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To: 2sheep
I can't lose any sleep over this case. If you sign a confession, you deserve to go to prison.

I'd be interested to see the nature of this DNA evidence. The finding of DNA from another individual doesn't rule out the possible (uncaptured) existence of this guy's DNA at the scene, as well.

4 posted on 08/28/2002 8:32:17 PM PDT by Friedrich Hayek
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To: 2sheep; PhilDragoo; Mrs Maher; Michael Maher
"The question you need to ask in these cases is: Did the suspect produce anything in that statement that the cops didn't already know? If not, you have to wonder."

This is a compelling statement.

It is my opinion that any man or woman can be broken when in custody and will sign false confessions, assuming the state is so inclined, evil and corrupt to do so.

I saw bits and pieces of this story last night on TV. Too bad it gets only 5 minutes air time.

5 posted on 08/28/2002 8:36:41 PM PDT by Fred Mertz
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To: 2sheep
DNA....God's signature. Nice definition.
6 posted on 08/28/2002 8:37:22 PM PDT by JessicaDragonet
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To: Friedrich Hayek; thegreatbeast; JessicaDragonet; Fred Mertz; Prodigal Daughter; Thinkin' Gal; ...
>I can't lose any sleep over this case. If you sign a confession, you deserve to go to prison.

Deception seems to be the name of the game.  Many of the Jews in WWII Germany just thought they were going to take a nice shower.  A person can be deceived by evil men and that doesn't make the victim evil.  Mt 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax coldOne can also be deceived into not caring for mankind.  That was the condition of Sodom and Gomorrah -- not just that the practiced sodomy, but that she strengthened not the hand of the poor and needy, i.e. didn't help and didn't care.  Just like many in America today.  G~d apparently considers that a great evil because he destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah.

Eze 16:49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.

Fulness of bread is similar to rich and increased with goods here*:

Re 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods*, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

There's a fire coming.

7 posted on 08/28/2002 8:54:45 PM PDT by 2sheep
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To: 2sheep
Some people, including the judge who was the prosecutor, should go to jail over this.
8 posted on 08/28/2002 8:55:05 PM PDT by Pushi
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To: thegreatbeast
"Saw this poor specimen on O'Reilly tonight. "

O'Really has gone bonkers. His attitude is that, "if a guy has been accused and there is one shread of circumstantial evidence, well sir, that is it. GUILTY! And if you defend him, you are a sleaze."

And, he uses the most flawed logic I have ever heard from an adult. Last night he stated that anyone who disputed that he held a pen in his had (showing what appeared to be a pen) was nuts and he would walk out of the room.

Well, my friends, I have a writing instrument that I challenge you to identify. Is it a pen? Pencil? Palm Pilot stylus...? Pick one... two!

No matter how you answer, I will guarantee to prove you wrong. You see, it is all three. It depends purely on how I hold it when I press the plunger.

Things are not always what they seem.

I sent this challenge to Bill O. He has not, and will not, respond. You see, he hates to be PROVEN wrong.

9 posted on 08/28/2002 9:00:18 PM PDT by lawdude
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To: Pushi
>Some people, including the judge who was the prosecutor, should go to jail over this.

You are correct, however, evil seems to have the upper hand in the country now and more innocent people are being arrested regularly.

"And will you profane Me among My people…
killing people who should not die,
and keeping people alive who should not live…?"
Ezek. 13:19

The same verse in KJB is:

Eze 13:19 And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies?

The same principle would be:

sending people to prison who should not be there,
and keeping people out of prison who should not be released…?"

Isa 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

10 posted on 08/28/2002 9:00:50 PM PDT by 2sheep
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To: 2sheep
I just hope that--as often the case with scientific theories--twenty years from now, we don't hear that DNA testing was inaccurate and as a result many guilty criminals were mistakenly set free.
11 posted on 08/28/2002 9:05:25 PM PDT by Age of Reason
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To: lawdude; Pushi; It'salmosttolate
>O'Really has gone bonkers. His attitude is that, "if a guy has been accused and there is one shread of circumstantial evidence, well sir, that is it. GUILTY! And if you defend him, you are a sleaze."  .....No matter how you answer, I will guarantee to prove you wrong.

Excellent.  You are right on all points.  Truth has fallen the street, and the presumption of innocence with it.  People are tried in the media and forums and polls are used not to measure opinion, but to twist it and profile people.

12 posted on 08/28/2002 9:09:03 PM PDT by 2sheep
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To: lawdude; Pushi; It'salmosttolate
>O'Really has gone bonkers. His attitude is that, "if a guy has been accused and there is one shread of circumstantial evidence, well sir, that is it. GUILTY! And if you defend him, you are a sleaze."  .....No matter how you answer, I will guarantee to prove you wrong.

Excellent.  You are right on all points.  Truth has fallen the street, and the presumption of innocence with it.  People are tried in the media and forums and polls are used not to measure opinion, but to twist it and profile people.

13 posted on 08/28/2002 9:09:25 PM PDT by 2sheep
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To: Age of Reason; lawdude
>we don't hear that DNA testing was inaccurate and as a result many guilty criminals were mistakenly set free.

It is rarely wrong to err on the side of grace. What we see today is convicted murderers and pedophiles let loose and innocent people falsely accused and jailed. "Justice" is that fine piece of truth that is missing because a government with an agenda can always twist the facts to fit that agenda.

The globalists have among their tactics, the idea to get people to accept and vote in tougher laws and penalties, like "three strikes and you're out" laws. The trouble is, those laws can be used against you in the future.

14 posted on 08/28/2002 9:18:30 PM PDT by 2sheep
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To: 2sheep
One can also be deceived into not caring for mankind.  That was the condition of Sodom and Gomorrah -- not just that the practiced sodomy, but that she strengthened not the hand of the poor and needy, i.e. didn't help and didn't care.  Just like many in America today

Frankly, I see it the other way around. America is the most giving country on the face of the earth and gives away countless millions upon billions in both taxes and charitable contributions to faces they never see and problems they never hear about. Always, someone has a hand out and America is there to put something of value in it: food, clothes, money, toys for kids, education (such as it is), a job... MONEY...

Do Americans receive ANY thanks for their trouble. You might get a homeless man to thank you for the dollar, but the vast majority think it's their entitlement and wonder in astonishment why there isn't any more. America poured it's heart out to the victims of 9/11 and what have you heard in the wake of all that charitable giving? Squabbling over the MILLIONS being given to each family and the hands out EXPECTING more. ANd lawyers to back them up!

I'll tell you, there is one precious-yet-renewable resource that is being burned away faster than it can be restored: a kind and charitable heart.

Sodom and Gomorrah may have fallen because the hearts of it's wealthy were hard, but America may yet fall because the hearts of her "poor" were even harder. They have milk and honey running out their mouths and have the audacity to complain that their bellies hurt because they aren't full enough.

15 posted on 08/28/2002 9:26:16 PM PDT by BradyLS
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To: Fred Mertz
It is my opinion that any man or woman can be broken when in custody and will sign false confessions, assuming the state is so inclined, evil and corrupt to do so.

Fred, Monaco police held Ted Maher for three days in four-point restraint, catheterized, sleep-deprived, threatened with the torture and strip-searching and indefinite detention of his wife, and unspecified harm to their children, until he signed their prepared false confession in French which he does not read, write or speak.

I was given the Stockdale, In Love and War, by my step-son, an otherly-surnamed graduate of the USNA Class of '94, and in it I believe the Admiral states we all broke; the point was to immediately begin resisting again.

The business of coercing confessions is sheer evil.

16 posted on 08/28/2002 9:27:45 PM PDT by PhilDragoo
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To: 2sheep
It is rarely wrong to err on the side of grace. What we see today is convicted murderers and pedophiles let loose and innocent people falsely accused and jailed.

I wonder how "innocent" many of these DNA acquitted prisoners are.

I wonder how much they resembled model citizens before being locked up.

I strongly suspect that if the cops framed or railroaded any of those people into jail, the cops did so because it was the only way to get those turned-loose murderers and pedophiles you speak of off the streets for a while, because the courts keep setting them free.

17 posted on 08/28/2002 9:29:33 PM PDT by Age of Reason
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To: 2sheep
Instead of my saying that I wonder how much they resembled model citizens before being locked up.

I should have said that I wonder how much they resembled model citizens before being locked up for the one crime they didn't do.

18 posted on 08/28/2002 9:31:24 PM PDT by Age of Reason
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To: PhilDragoo; Nita Nupress
I've read and shared your Ted Maher threads with others. I just shared it with an officemate today. That's why I flagged you here. Keep up the good fight.
19 posted on 08/28/2002 9:32:02 PM PDT by Fred Mertz
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To: Fred Mertz
I saw Barry Scheck, the DNA expert, on Hannity and Colmes tonite and both H & C congratulated him for pursuing justice and righting this wrong. They briefly showed the guy who had been released, and he seemed a little off, slow maybe. If he was mentally ill and the police took advantage of this to coerce a false confession, they should be prosecuted themselves.
20 posted on 08/28/2002 9:43:39 PM PDT by Ciexyz
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