A clear and present danger: Ashcroft scheme simply chilling

HoustonChronicle.com ^ | Aug. 16, 2002, 7:49PM | Turley is a professor of constitutional law at George Washington University, in Washington, D.C.

[Stavka2]

Believe it or not, while you guys are oft almost aimlessly and reflexively slamming liberals when they deserve it or not, you need them as much as anything to equally counterbalance the Republicans...because guess what...without a counter balance, both sides will become sanctimonious arseholes who will equally control and censor the population...though for different reasons but in the end to the same effect. McCarthy comes to mind. Do you recall the US used to have censor boards that determined for adults what they could and could not see or hear. No thanks to either side. As an educated adult I will pick what I see, hear and think for myself.

[BellStar]

Someone who's willing to strip away the rights of Americans in the name of security?

As I said Esam hamdi is about as much an American as I'm Japanese! Ashcroft's "scheme" is a Solomon like decision made with all the facts which were conveniently left out of Turley's Op Ed ! I lived in Europe for 3 years but that does not make me a European! Nor am I British for having lived in London for 3 years. Ashcroft knows what he is doing. And those who look closely know he is no threat to our Constitutional Rights.

[lawdude]

"Ashcroft remains a sanctimonious fraud and a dangerous man."

Yup. Since he has been in position, he has killed, incarcerated thousands. Reactionary BS.

[Stavka2]

Ok, that's one guy and what about the other, who was born and lived in America? Hmmm?

[SLOTownConservative]

His greatest problem has been preserving a level of panic and fear that would induce a free people to surrender the rights so dearly won by their ancestors.

plus:Any attempt to create the foundation for a parallel "terrorists-only" judicial system is a threat to the freedom of all Americans, IMO.

Perhaps we should just let them all go and see what happens?

[Raymond Hendrix]

After all is said and done I must say that we are heading down a path that is not good. It can be great fun picking on the liberals but we should clean up our own house first. I wish that those who are all for this new era of security and safety would answer these questions:

1. When is this war going to end?

2. When will our liberties return?

3. Who decides when we get them back or when the war ends?

4. When Germany rose to power under Hitler some did not complain because they were not "Jews" "unionists" etc. Then they were taken to the camps. What prevents YOU from being charged and held without trial and without access to an attorney?

5. Who decides who and who does not deserve the rights guaranteed in the Bill of Rights? And who will decide when Bush and Ashcroft are out of office?

6. What precedent are we setting and how can we argue against it when someone else is in power that we do not trust?

[SAJ]

Throughout US history, although the US has participated in upwards of 200 armed conflicts of various descriptions, the Regress has only declared war 5 times. If not mistaken, these were: War of 1812, War of Northern Aggression, Spanish-American War, WW I, WW II. The Regress, in all its political posturing, couldn't even be bothered to declare war against Iraq in 1990-1991.

The argument that there is no state of war because the Regress hasn't declared war is historically fatuous at best.

[Dimensio]

So you believe that people suspected of terrorism should be treated to a different judicial process than other people?

[BenLurkin]

Ashcroft remains a sanctimonious fraud and a dangerous man.
This proposition deserves scrutiny and debate.
Mr. Cogburn may be right. (This time)

[RJCogburn]

Did I miss something, RJ, or is it just that you are the only one who carries a license for launching ad hominem attacks?

Sorry, officer, I must have left my license at home. ;^)

Since you asked.....

Ashcroft, while presenting himself as a moral person of faith who will always do the right thing and seek justice,disbanded the campaign finance task force...which means Chinagate...which means our national security. Or, does Ashcroft just get top pick which aspects of national security he will sanctify with his blessing.

Ashcroft sent away Robert Conrad, the head of the task force. It was Conrad, you may recall, who told JReno to appoint an IC to investigate Gore.

Still wearing his righteous hat, Ashcroft signed off on the deal that fined the shareholders of Loral $millions while agreeing to let the criminals go free.

Ashcroft, snactimonious as always, chose to ignore government corruption in the matters of the lynx fur scandal and the BIA backdating scandals....though one would expect a truely moral, righteous, dedicated public servant to pursue corruption in the government he has swore to serve, 'so help me God'.

Moving along, he decided to overturn the will of the people of a sovereign state by his own fiat, even though that will had been clearly expressed in referendum, dangerously to the concept of liberty. (I'm speaking about Oregon, for those who may not have been paying attention.) He decided to block release of information of the abuses in the Boston FBI office, where the criminals are protected and the innocent incarcerated.

His current plan would allow him to incarcerate you at his whim. Oh, yes, he is a both a sanctimonious fraud and a dangerous man, alright.

[donozark]

Padilla is a drug-dealing, gang-banging convicted MURDERER! The fact these incidents were adjudicated while a juvenile do not excuse him. If AG Ashcroft wants him locked up? There is a darn good reason for it.

[William Terrell]

You left out that he is a deeply religious, patriotic American.

You left out that any powers he establishes in the Justice Dept will carry over to his successor, who may not be a "deeply religious, patriotic American".

[SLOTownConservative]

Will you say the same when President H Rodham starts interning gun owners, tax protesters and members of the pro-life movement?

Whatever powers this new Imperial administration decides to grant itself will carry over to the next administration. Someday, the Democrats will be back in the Whitehouse and you better be ready for how they'll use the power.

This is certainly the scariest part of what we are going through now. I don't doubt we can deal with any military or terrorist attack on our citizens. But the changes wrought trying to prevent one more death due to terrorist action may set us up for some long term pain.

Perhaps the Ashcroft opponents are right. Maybe we shouldn't try to stop the next death and just let them happen. This would be political suicide for the administration, but would be better for the nation in the long run. And least that is the opponents view. They would just as soon see the present administration replaced regardless of means. A few good citizen deaths would be well worth the price. It is a noble end after all.

If this was the approach taken the clamor to do something would be deafening. And the “something” would be done by an administration that is a polar opposite to the one in office. Further to the right or further to the left would be the only options. (I seem to have three poles going in my argument – you get the picture anyway I hope!) Neither would be a good choice IMHO.

Being a conservative I am much more comfortable with the current approach, even with the perceived erosion of liberty, at least the current degree of erosion, than I would be with a replacement administration from the right or left. Personally, I’d guess if the administration took a hands off approach the next administration, and congress, would be from the far right. I'm sure the liberals, who know all anyway, have a different view.

[William Terrell]

Ashcroft knows what he is doing. And those who look closely know he is no threat to our Constitutional Rights.

Did you forget Ashcroft will not hold his post for life? Do you think that those powers will be rescinded when he leaves? Do you think?

[BellStar]

Yes!

[BellStar]

Yes!

[dogbyte12]

Padilla is a drug-dealing, gang-banging convicted MURDERER! The fact these incidents were adjudicated while a juvenile do not excuse him. If AG Ashcroft wants him locked up? There is a darn good reason for it.

Well, Randy Weaver was a gun law breaking militia man plotting to overthrow the US. Or so will say the next Democratic President who uses this scary tactic that Ashcroft is using.

Here is the smell test for a law when your party is in power. Would you like the other side to use it? If you trust Janet Reno to decide which Americans are to be deprived of their bill of rights, be my guest and support Ashcroft's assault on our constitution.

[KayEyeDoubleDee]

If these clowns have done something wrong, then charge them and give them a fair trial

OTOH, it is a bit discomforting to think that enemy combatants might get OJ's jurors.

[BellStar]

Tin foil hats anyone?

[William Terrell]

Let's take the equestion one by one.

Do you expect Ashcroft to hold office for life?

Yes or No.