Camps for Citizens: Ashcroft's Hellish Vision

Los Angeles Times ^ | Aug. 14, 2002 | Jonathan Turley

[JohnathanRGalt]

Camps for Citizens: Ashcroft's Hellish Vision

Attorney general shows himself as a menace to liberty.

by JONATHAN TURLEY, Jonathan Turley is a professor of constitutional law at George Washington University.

Atty. Gen. John Ashcroft's announced desire for camps for U.S. citizens he deems to be "enemy combatants" has moved him from merely being a political embarrassment to being a constitutional menace.

Ashcroft's plan, disclosed last week but little publicized, would allow him to order the indefinite incarceration of U.S. citizens and summarily strip them of their constitutional rights and access to the courts by declaring them enemy combatants.

The proposed camp plan should trigger immediate congressional hearings and reconsideration of Ashcroft's fitness for this important office. Whereas Al Qaeda is a threat to the lives of our citizens, Ashcroft has become a clear and present threat to our liberties.

(. . . .)

Ashcroft is a catalyst for constitutional devolution, encouraging citizens to accept autocratic rule as their only way of avoiding massive terrorist attacks.

His greatest problem has been preserving a level of panic and fear that would induce a free people to surrender the rights so dearly won by their ancestors.

[JohnathanRGalt]

All he has to do is change the color code on the Homeland Security terror-alert from yellow to orange - that'll increase the panic level enough.

So, is this why are all the Islamist terrorist groups (Hamas, Hezbullah, Laskar Jehad, ...) given free reign to continue to operate in this country? To preserve a level and panic and fear that would induce a free people to surrender the rights so dearly won by their ancestors.

[headsonpikes]

I'm afraid you're right.

[RJCogburn]

I have repeatedly ad nauseum posted that Ashcroft is a sanctimonious fraud and a dangerous man.

He is becoming even more dangerous.

[willgetsome]

You base your arguments and your hysteria on an article in the L.A. Times? LOL

[Eternal_Bear]

I heard that they have "prison" trains ready. They have shackles built into cars. Guess they are going to haul away a lot of "enemies of the state". Whatever happened to "America, Land of the Free"? I guess that was just a dream we had.

[pabianice]

WAY behind the curve. Brainwashing camps for citizens have existed for 30 years. They're called public universities.

[Roscoe]

Don't forget about the space aliens who will perform rectal probes on the prisoners!

[JohnathanRGalt]

I'm afraid you're right.

The Israeli's give fair and open trials to terrorists they capture. They prove that they are terrorists and convict them of their crimes in a court of law.

[freddy]

Store away an extra can of tuna and keep your powder dry...

Times are a changin...!!!

[zook]

Get ready for this: the present policy is no different than that used during WWII and upheld by the SC.

I applaud Ashcroft and Bush for taking this tough stand against enemy combatants, whether US citizens or not.

The pissing and moaning of the black and pink helcopter crowds is becoming very old and tired. If we start to see rampant abuse of this policy, give me a call and I'll work with you. Otherwise, give me a huge break.

[Isle of sanity in CA]

JohnathanRGalt/Headsonpikes seem to hail from Canada/UK.

Perhaps they are under the impression that we are all living in fear, huddled and shivering at the thought of the EVIL government coming to get us just because they can...

We should assure them that all's well. The libertarians haven't been rounded up yet...

[zook]

Not during open war, not for captured enemy combatants.

[headsonpikes]

RE: "...living in fear..."

I am under no such impression.

I just note the 'FDR-ness' of the rhetoric.

Frankly, I find Rooseveltian Socialism as frightening as any other style. Your mileage may vary.

P.S. and FYI: I read threads; so avoiding flagging me to a post that mentions me may not always elude my inspection.

[Recovering_Democrat]

Turley said:
Of course, Ashcroft is not considering camps on the order of the internment camps used to incarcerate Japanese American citizens in World War II. But he can be credited only with thinking smaller; we have learned from painful experience that unchecked authority, once tasted, easily becomes insatiable.

Horse dung. Turley, while on the side of justice during Klintoon's impeachment, is absolutely wrong. When did the Supreme Court declare those camps unconstitutional? Anyone?

And for those of you who are blasting Ashcroft, you're off base, too. We have enemies within. WHATEVER IT TAKES to find them, and kill them, is the barometer in wartime.

History teaches us two things:
1. Enemies cannot be given leeway just because they've infiltrated our society: in fact, they must be weeded out.

2. Civil liberties "endangered" during wars (most notably, our Civil War and World War II) are restored immediately upon the cessation of hostilities. Abe Lincoln and FDR engaged in questionable practices regarding the Constitution...and once their wars were over, the Federal government stopped--citizens and the officials realized those extreme measures were temporary and necessary.

Take off the tin-foil, please, and keep an eye out for the Enemy. He is not US.

[KC_Conspirator]

Consider the source. Jonathan Turley also is leading a lawsuit against the United States for hiding evidence of UFO's at Groom Lake.

[KC_Conspirator]

Oh, and BTW, we had over 500,000 Germans held in camps in the US during WWII.

[JohnathanRGalt]

JohnathanRGalt/Headsonpikes seem to hail from Canada/UK.

So what? The thing that really made the United States a great country and an example to the world was:

• the Declaration of Independence
• the Constitution / Bill of Rights

Tear those up - and "the terrorists will have won".

[mysterio]

I can only imagine what policy will come next. Ashcroft Youth, where kids learn the warning signs that their parents might be planning a terrorist attack or cheating on their taxes?


Attorney General John Ashcroft announces "Ashcroft Youth" as part of the War on Terror. Signup will be mandatory for all children ages 8-13. Children will engage in activities twice a month, including fishing, boating, and high tech listening devices. Ashcroft commented, "National security begins at home. It's just not fair that this country has no established system for kids to turn in their parents for unpatriotic remarks. We designed the best system we could to protect American liberty, while giving these kids a chance to participate and learn about how government works.

[Wonder Warthog]

"Civil liberties "endangered" during wars (most notably, our Civil War and World War II) are restored immediately upon the cessation of hostilities. Abe Lincoln and FDR engaged in questionable practices regarding the Constitution...and once their wars were over, the Federal government stopped--citizens and the officials realized those extreme measures were temporary and necessary."

Wrong--things never seem to go QUITE all the way back to the status quo ante-bellum. Every "emergency/war/whatever" causes just a LEETLE bit more erosion of our liberties. Look how much "regress" we have made with the "War on Drugs".