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I am not rationalizing violations of the Constitution. There is no way that CFR should or could be rationalized. I hoped (and lost) that Bush would not sign it. Now that he has, I've got to hope the Supreme Court rules it out. If they do not, then we've suffered a lost battle, but the war against liberalism/socialism rages on. The only way to defeat these guys is to toss out the worst of the lot every chance you get. And even though we've suffered this setback, you will still find the worst of the lot of socialists over in the Democrat party. If you ever want to win back your freedom, you must defeat the Democrats first. It would be a great day when the Democrats are defeated and the battle for liberty is narrowed to Republican vs Constitutionalist. But, for the time being, the Constitutionalists are not even on the battlefield. They have no army to speak of. The political war in America is between the Democrats and Republicans. The tiny third parties stand no chance at defeating either, much less both at the same time. So I say, defeat the leftist Democrat party first. That's my rationalization. You can take it or leave it. Or you may join the others with their continued mantra that there is no difference. But I do not believe that. I've seen the men and women of both parties in action and, sorry, but there is obviously a big difference. Check out conservative.org.

Is there a difference between these:

Richard C. Shelby (R-AL)
Frank H. Murkowski (R-AK)
John Kyl (R-AZ)
Wayne Allard (R-CO)
Pat Roberts (R-KS)
Jim Bunning (R-KY)
Robert C. Smith (R-NH)
Jesse Helms (R-NC)
Rick Santorum (R-PA)
Strom Thurmond (R-SC)
Bill Frist (R-TN)
Robert Bennett (R-UT)

and these?

Barbara Boxer (D-CA)
Richard J. Durbin (D-IL)
Paul David Wellstone (D-MN)
Jon Corzine (D-NJ)

Or these:

Terry Everett (R-AL)
Bob Riley (R-AL)
J. D. Hayworth (R-AZ)
John Doolittle (R-CA)
Edward Royce (R-CA)
Gary G. Miller (R-CA)
Duncan Hunter (R-CA)
Bob Schaffer (R-CO)
Thomas G. Tancredo (R-CO)
Jack Kingston (R-GA)
Bob Barr (R-GA)
Saxby Chambliss (R-GA)
Nathan Deal (R-GA)
Philip M. Crane (R-IL)
Mike Pence (R-IN)
Dan Burton (R-IN)
Jim R. Ryun (R-KS)
Ron Lewis (R-KY)
David Vitter (R-LA)
Todd Akin (R-MO)
Earnest Istook, Jr. (R-OK)
Pat Toomey (R-PA)
Joseph R. Pitts (R-PA)
Floyd Spence (R-SC)
Jim DeMint (R-SC)
Ed Bryant (R-TN)
Sam Johnson (R-TX)
Pete Sessions (R-TX)
John A. Culberson (R-TX)
Tom DeLay (R-TX)
James V. Hansen (R-UT)
Chris Cannon (R-UT)
Jo Ann S. Davis (R-VA)
Edward L. Schrock (R-VA)
J. Randy Forbes (R-VA)
Eric I. Cantor (R-VA)
Barbara Cubin (R-WY)

and these?

Robert T. Matsui (D-CA)
Lynn Woolsey (D-CA)
George Miller (D-CA)
Nancy Pelosi (D-CA)
Barbara Lee (D-CA)
Fortney H. “Pete” Stark (D-CA)
Anna Eshoo (D-CA)
Mike Honda (D-CA)
Zoe Lofgren (D-CA)
Sam Farr (D-CA)
Henry A. Waxman (D-CA)
Xavier Becerra (D-CA)
Hilda L. Solis (D-CA)
Diane E. Watson (D-CA)
Lucille Roybal-Allard (D-CA)
Maxine Waters (D-CA)
Bob Filner (D-CA)
Diana L. DeGette (D-CO)
Mark Udall (D-CO)
Rosa DeLauro (D-CT)
John Lewis (D-GA)
Jesse Jackson, Jr. (D-IL)
Janice D. Schakowsky (D-IL)
Lane Evans (D-IL)
Thomas H. Allen (D-ME)
John W. Olver (D-MA)
Barney Frank (D-MA)
Marty Meehan (D-MA)
John F. Tierney (D-MA)
Martin Olav Sabo (D-MN)
Donald M. Payne (D-NJ)
Rush Holt (D-NJ)
Jerrold Nadler (D-NY)
Anthony David Weiner (D-NY)
Nydia Velazquez (D-NY)
Carolyn Maloney (D-NY)
Jose E. Serrano (D-NY)
Nita M. Lowey (D-NY)
Maurice Hinchey (D-NY)
Louise McIntosh Slaughter (D-NY)
EVA M. Clayton (D-NC)
Mel Watt (D-NC)
Thomas C. Sawyer (D-OH)
Earl Blumenauer (D-OR)
Chaka Fattah (D-PA)
Joeseph M. Hoeffel III (D-PA)
William J. Coyne (D-PA)
Jim McDermott (D-WA)
Tammy Baldwin (D-WI)
Thomas Barrett (D-WI)

You betcha.

Thanks. Not saying I'm convinced, but that's the most succinct argument for banding together in order to defeat Democrats that I've heard. I'll consider it.

In other words, you do not want to see the rest of America go the way of our home state, eh??

When "Winning is Everything" serves as a philosophical foundation, anything can be rationalized. That's all we're really witnessing here. - #373 - posted by Sandy

"Rationalization in the defense of winning liberty is no vice." - JR - #377 -

Well said Sandy.
The rationalization of constitutional violations for political reasons is a dangerous vice indeed. - tpaine -

I am not rationalizing violations of the Constitution. There is no way that CFR should or could be rationalized.
I hoped (and lost) that Bush would not sign it. Now that he has, I've got to hope the Supreme Court rules it out.
If they do not, then we've suffered a lost battle, but the war against liberalism/socialism rages on.

Sorry, JR, -- I can see now that you were rationalizing a 'winning philosophy'. -- I took that to the next step, as far too many republican politicians are doing [Bush included, imo], where, as Sandy in effect noted, they are abandoning all pretense of following the constitution in unprincipled efforts to 'win'. --- I doubt they will. -- We will all lose.

If you ever want to win back your freedom, you must defeat the Democrats first. It would be a great day when the Democrats are defeated and the battle for liberty is narrowed to Republican vs Constitutionalist.

I disagree. FR has taught me that the real battle is for the constitution. It matters little if 'republicans' win control if neo-socialist RINOs control the party.

But, for the time being, the Constitutionalists are not even on the battlefield. They have no army to speak of. The political war in America is between the Democrats and Republicans.

Yep, and the socialists are winning because real constitutional conservatives are shut out of the republican party. We [conservatives] have to find a way to give these socialist sheepie their security, while we get back our constitutional freedoms.

That ain't gonna happen within the framework of the present day republican party. Don't kid yourself.