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To: Physicist
"Read 212 again. I specified natural speciation. Of course we can force changes now (unnatural speciation), but that doesn't alter the history of life on Earth."

Of course speciation alters the history of Life on Earth. We've got pigs growing organs for humans now. That's very different from what we had on Earth 1,000 years ago.

The whole point of ID is that speciation is not natural, just as the whole point of the math proof for this thread is that very large amounts of data can not (mathematically) self-form naturally.

I gave you an example of speciation that was NOT natural. Said example was also NOT predicted by Evolutionary Theory.

You are now arguing that because said speciation event was not "natural", that it doesn't count. That's the same as saying that no evidence which ID can produce (since ID holds that speciation events are not natural) will satisfy you.

And that means that Evolutionary Theory is NOT falsifiable (to you).

Non-falsifiable theories are not scientific, by definition.

Congratulations. You've just moved Darwinism into fantasy books alongside Flat-Earthers...

298 posted on 03/07/2002 9:25:20 PM PST by Southack
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To: Southack
The whole point of ID is that speciation is not natural, just as the whole point of the math proof for this thread is that very large amounts of data can not (mathematically) self-form naturally.

The "proof" for this thread shows that very large amounts of data cannot self-form in one step. It's a huge leap to go from there to saying that it can never self-form. The whole point of evolution is that it is done tiny step by tiny step. Nobody has ever claimed that the first cell simply fell together one day in all its modern complexity.

You are now arguing that because said speciation event was not "natural", that it doesn't count.

No, I'm arguing that because that ability arose in the 20th century, it is unable to explain the speciation that occurred prior to the 20th century. People weren't around when the dinosaurs first appeared, so we could not have created them. If you want to claim that somebody else created them, you have to demonstrate who did it and how. Showing what we do now is neither here nor there.

I'm perfectly happy to state that when human beings effect changes in the genomes of organisms, those specific changes are not themselves evolved. But for every such change you can point to, I can point to a host of others that occurred naturally.

Human beings have put satellites in orbit around the Earth. Does that necessarily mean that therefore some intelligence put the moon in place?

308 posted on 03/08/2002 3:09:23 AM PST by Physicist
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