[Gophack]

Again, we do not pray TO saints, we ask saints to pray TO God FOR us, just like I might ask my husband to pray FOR me before surgery, or I might pray FOR my daughter before her big dance recital. If I die, I first hope that I am in a state of grace to go to heaven, and if I am blessed to see the glory of God, I would praise God and pray TO Him for everyone I loved.

[la$tminutepardon]

Well then what was the purpose for Christ's death and ripping the veil from top to bottom so that we could approach God directly? Don't you think you afront Him by going to dead people first? The theology is clear-- pray only to the Father. Call no man Father. Your prepositions to and for are Clintonesque -- Mary's no different from all the other dead in Christ, Moses, Miriam, Uncle Pete. Ypu break the first commandment by praying to Mary and the rest. You have to pray to her since she's not here in the body-- if she was, I'd ask her to pray for me too, as I would any other human. -- If it wasn't an important thing, it wouldn't be the first commandment.

[woollyone]

"Again, we do not pray TO saints, we ask saints to pray TO God FOR us"

So, you don't pray to the saints, you ask them huh?.

So, the next question would be...How do you ask them. Would it happen to be through prayer perhaps? Crystal ball? Miss Cleo? That guy on TV who talks to dead people? Tarrot cards? Ouigi board?

Let's go one step further...
Essentially, you "talk" to the dead people, though some other means than prayer...but in order to ask them, you certainly must be in communication with these dead people.

Do you think that communicating with dead in any fashion people is OK (regardless of the Biblical admonition not to do so)?

...depends on what the definition of the word "pray" is...

Lastly, what exactly, in your view is prayer?
Wouldn't it casually be defined as communicating/talking to...?

In summary, regardless or your creative verb usage, it sounds like you do pray to dead people after all.

Let me put this in the form of a very simple analogy...

God is the Judge of all men
Jesus, is the Son of the Judge, and is the ready advocate (lawyer), Who is ready and willing to provide any man an aquittal through His connections to His Father the Judge. What a better attorney could any man ask for than the Son of the Judge?

Before walking into court, each man already knows that he will be found guilty and punished. But the Judge's Son has already offered a free gift of forgiveness if the defendant will allow the Judge's Son to defend him...to be his propitiation.

Given such a direct line to aquittal available to every defendant...
why would anyone choose to through another guilty convict, to serve as a laison, to have a talk with the Judge's Son so the Judges Son could talk with the Judge, when the defendant could go directly to the Judge's Son for himself?

Would seem rather silly don't you think?