Posted on 10/24/2020 3:10:35 PM PDT by doug from upland
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It is the nightmare scenario Pennsylvania election officials have fretted over for months: a knock-down, drag-out fight over which presidential candidate will win the state and snag its coveted electoral votes. Advertisement 01:10 05:37
Now, the head of the Republican Party of Pennsylvania has fueled fears of chaos after Election Day, raising the specter that his party could break with tradition and allow the GOP-controlled Legislature to choose a slate of presidential electors to cast the states votes for Donald Trump even if the president doesnt win the popular vote.
In comments to The Atlantic made public this week, state Republican Chairman Lawrence Tabas suggested that he had spoken with Trump campaign officials about the possibility of bypassing the results of the popular vote, should there be uncertainty or disputes over the validity of ballots cast. The U.S. Constitution, Tabas said, allows state legislatures to choose presidential electors.
(Excerpt) Read more at mcall.com ...
I know that's the argument, but if a state legislature makes a law on how electors will be selected, and that law's signed by the governor, I'm not sure they can just ignore it when it's inconvenient.
That would mean the constitution and the governor really have no power because the legislature can unilaterally dictate state law.
The reality is the legislature would be violating state law and the state constitution but SCOTUS may say that's OK since it's a federal election.
I'm skeptical.
Once the state legislature determines how electors are selected they codify it by passing a law per their States constitution. How else could they do it?
I think its implicit when the Constitution says the state legislators decide how electors are chosen it means they choose consistent with the constitution of their respective states.
Otherwise it means state legislatures arent bound by their state constitutions and theres absolutely no balance of powers.
Not what I think the framers intended.
The Pa Court can’t rule on a US constitutional specified process for legislatures dealing with uncertainties in a federal election and the assignment of electors. It can rule on what is to be done for votes on the state races.
Now how the SCOTUS might rule if the process is challenged is another matter.
First, Pennsylvania has to allow the time for court challenges to proceed. Then they have to allow time for appeals. However, they have to get all of this done before the Electoral College safe harbor date, or Pennsylvania will not participate in the Electoral College.
- November 7, 2000 - Election Day
- November 14, 2000 - Deadline for certifying the election.
- November 15, 2000
- Broward and Dade counties ignore deadline and continue manual recounting.
- Florida state Supreme Court denies petitions to stop recounts after deadline.
- Florida Secretary of State announces she will not include further returns from the counties.
- November 16, 2000
- Gore campaign files a challenge to the certified results.
- Florida Supreme Court allows West Palm Beach to continue manual recounts.
- November 17, 2000 - Florida Supreme Court bars Secretary of State from certifying the election "until further order of the court."
- November 20, 2000 - Florida Supreme Court hears arguments regarding inclusion of hand-recounted ballots.
- November 21, 2000 - Florida Supreme Court rules manual recounts can continue.
- November 22, 2000 - Bush campaign files in federal court for review of Florida Supreme Court ruling.
- November 23, 2000 - Gore campaign files in Florida Supreme Court to force Dade county to continue recounts. Court denies request.
- November 24, 2000 - US Supreme Court agrees to hear case.
- November 26, 2000 - Florida Secretary of State certifies election.
- November 27, 2000 - Gore campaign files to contest the Florida election.
- December 1, 2000 - US Supreme Court hears oral arguments.
- December 2, 2000 - Florida Circuit Court begins election contest trial.
- December 4, 2000
- US Supreme Court vacates Florida Supreme Court decision.
- Florida Circuit Court rules against Gore campaign.
- December 7, 2000
- Florida Supreme Court hears appeal of Florida Circuit Court ruling.
- Florida legislature issues proclamation calling for special session to consider appointing Electors.
- December 8, 2000
- Florida Supreme Court reverses Circuit Court ruling against Gore campaign.
- Bush campaign seeks stay of Florida Supreme Court ruling.
- Florida legislature meets in special session and adjourns to meet again on December 12.
- December 9, 2000
- Florida begins manual recount of "undervote" ballots.
- Florida Supreme Court denies Bush campaign request for stay of order.
- US Supreme Court issues stay to stop manual recounts.
- December 11, 2000 - US Supreme Court hears oral arguments on Florida recount.
- December 12, 2000
- Florida legislature meets and approves 25 Electors pledged to Bush.
- US Supreme Court issues ruling: 7-2 to overturn Florida Supreme Court ruling on recounts, saying that recounts must be statewide for "equal protection;" 5-4 that remedies not possible by deadlines.
- December 13, 2000 - Gore campaign concedes Florida election, declares Bush the winner.
- December 18, 2000 - Electoral College meets and selects George W. Bush as President.
Now, shift that timeline by another 10 days due to pushing out the return of "mail-in" ballots. That is the chaos that Democrats want to inject into the 2020 election in at least five states.
Article II Section 1:
The Congress may determine the Time of chusing the Electors, and the Day on which they shall give their Votes; which Day shall be the same throughout the United States.The clause in Article II Section 1 mandating the Electoral College meet on the same day is what ultimately prevents this from spilling over into the new year. The Electoral College will meet whether these states participate or not. If they do not participate due to self-inflicted delays, the 270 vote threshold for majority will be reduced by half the Electoral votes of the states that fail to participate.
If things get the brink, that means the legislature has the choice of letting Pennsylvania go un represented in the election of the President, or they step in at the last minute and make a choice.
-PJ
Thank you for the excellent explanation!
I don't blame you for assuming that the PA supreme court would be beholden to the boundaries of their authority and subject to the limits placed on it by the US and PA constitutions as well as established case law and applicable legislation at both the state and federal levels.
I want to emphasize that this is not a safe assumption and if the leftists see an opportunity to steer things to a desired outcome, they will find a way to take it. The PA supreme court already this year has effectively rewritten state election laws by fiat on multiple occasions, decided to give the Governor unlimited power to keep the economy shut down without any effective check on his power by the legislature, and this is after their stunt a few years ago when they redrew legislative districts by fiat. To their great shame, the republicans in the state have mostly let them.
Sure, if a case gets to the US Supreme court, there's more of a chance that a bad decision gets overturned or set aside, but the PA supreme court has already placed its dirty thumbs on the scales of fairness multiple times, allowing mail in ballots without postmarks or matching signatures to be counted up to three days after the election. The vote pool could be so dirty in a close election that there would be no effective means of resolving it, and I don't doubt that if it came to it, and if the PA supreme court didn't somehow usurp this authority, the PA legislature would suddenly lose its nerve to vote for a slate of republican electors in the case of a conflicted result.
PA has to be won decisively and outside the margin for fraud, because fraud is going to seep its way in otherwise and even if it resulted in a Trump victory, it would allow for the same claims of illegitimacy that the Dems used in 2000, but this time it would be weaponized.
The state legislature is a creation of the states constitution. Without that constitution the legislature doesnt exist, so to say the legislature can ignore the legislative rules laid out in the state constitution is nonsensical.
Its true that the federal constitution ranks above the state constitutions, but the state legislatures are subordinate to both.
If the state constitution says election laws have to be signed by the governor or get a two thirds majority in both state houses the legislature cant do anything to change that but amend the constitution.
The legislature can choose the method of selecting electors but it has to do it within the confines of the constitution that created it. The US Constitution doesnt grant the state legislature any extra-(state)constitutional lawmaking powers.
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