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Have you ever used an interlinear? or even a concordance? It is amazing what simple tools like Berry's or Young's and Strong's can show you.

I'll accept that response as a "no".

Why did it take until the 4th Century to formalize Jesus as God?

Because the clear teachings of the first century were being perverted by heretics who thought they knew more than the Apostles and their immediate disciples. Error was creeping into the Church and the various churches got together to make a formal statement as to what the Church Fathers and the Apostles had been teaching for 400 years.

When y'all can explain how those many clear verses and concepts that show differences between God and Jesus work then I'll return the favor on the other verses, but until then it just shows that you have failed to look at your religious template with an honest and critical eye.

If I were to show you the clear verses in the Bible that confirm that Jesus Christ is God Almighty, would you change your view? Are you open to being taught on this subject, or is your current view the one you plan on taking to the grave?

So what Church do you attend or what church are do you hold membership? Or are you just a "Lone Christian" making up your theology as you go?

BTW I am pining our resident Greek and Hebrew Scholars to this thread in case there is a question regarding the original intent of the scriptures.

*chuckle* Remember a few years ago when I was called a modalist and a heretic because I questioned whether "three Persons" was the best way of expressing the Godhead? I've since come to the conclusion that I was right, but that the original Nicene and Athenasian Creeds are technically right as well.

The confusion stems from the fact that the meaning of the key terms--"person" and "begotten" in particular--has changed over time, but the translations haven't kept up and the churches haven't done a good job of educating their people.

The fact is that the Diety of Messiah isn't that difficult to illustrate if one simply accepts that He is the embodiment of what Scripture calls God's Word, His Glory, His Face, His Right Arm, His Wisdom, His Light, His Torah--that which the rabbis call the Sh'khinah. He is generated rather than created or fashioned from God, who is the Father. Just as the Sun doesn't sit down with tools and fashion light, but rather generates light as part of its quintessential nature, so God generates (begets) His Light as a part of His nature.

That illustration, btw, was used by both Tertullian and Irenaeus (if anyone wants to challenge their credentials as Christians, go right on ahead), and by R. Eliezer in explaining the Sh'khinah, the Divine Presence.

Pretty much my only problem with Trinitarianism is its tendency to overemphasize "Tri-". HaShem Echad. Too many Christians are functional Tri-theists, utterly ignorant of their own creeds (even though they'll instantly question the salvation of someone who questions them) and incapable of answering even basic questions about Trinitarianism themselves.

I'm not shooting this at anyone being pinged here. I'm just lamenting the situation in general, especially since it personally impacted me a few years ago, including the loss of at least one FRiend. I still greatly appreciate the support I got from my fellow Neeners.

If I hadn't gotten that support, and if I hadn't delved into this matter through not only Scripture directly, but through both the Christian and the Jewish commentators, I too might have come to the conclusion that "Trinity" was a 4th Century heresy that needed to be expunged rather than being simply misunderstood by the vast majority of its adherants.

Shalom.