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Convincing the climate-change skeptics
The Boston Globe ^ | August 4, 2008 | John P. Holdren

Posted on 08/04/2008 5:07:07 AM PDT by AU72

THE FEW climate-change "skeptics" with any sort of scientific credentials continue to receive attention in the media out of all proportion to their numbers, their qualifications, or the merit of their arguments. And this muddying of the waters of public discourse is being magnified by the parroting of these arguments by a larger population of amateur skeptics.

First, they tell you you're wrong and they can prove it. (In this case, "Climate isn't changing in unusual ways or, if it is, human activities are not the cause.")

Then they tell you you're right but it doesn't matter. ("OK, it's changing and humans are playing a role, but it won't do much harm.") Finally, they tell you it matters but it's too late to do anything about it. ("Yes, climate disruption is going to do some real damage, but it's too late, too difficult, or too costly to avoid that, so we'll just have to hunker down and suffer.")

All three positions are represented among the climate-change skeptics who infest talk shows, Internet blogs, letters to the editor, op-ed pieces, and cocktail-party conversations. The few with credentials in climate-change science have nearly all shifted in the past few years from the first category to the second, however, and jumps from the second to the third are becoming more frequent.

The extent of unfounded skepticism about the disruption of global climate by human-produced greenhouse gases is not just regrettable, it is dangerous. It has delayed - and continues to delay - the development of the political consensus that will be needed if society is to embrace remedies commensurate with the challenge. The science of climate change is telling us that we need to get going. Those who still think this is all a mistake or a hoax need to think again.

(Excerpt) Read more at boston.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: agw; climate; climatechange; environment; warming
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If you can't pound the facts, pound the table.

I am also scrathcing my head over what's climate changing in unusual ways.

1 posted on 08/04/2008 5:07:08 AM PDT by AU72
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To: AU72
Well, back in Antediluvian Times, we called it

"having weather..."

2 posted on 08/04/2008 5:10:20 AM PDT by backhoe (Just an old keyboard cowboy, ridin' the Trakball in to the Sunset...)
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To: AU72
This guy is trying to boost the "credentialed scientist" position? And he's doing so by trotting out three strawman arguments?

Pathetic.

3 posted on 08/04/2008 5:13:10 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy (Et si omnes ego non)
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To: AU72; Carry_Okie; ancient_geezer
Members of the public who are tempted to be swayed by the denier fringe...

This from a purported "scientist" from Haaaaaavaaaahd? Is this the much vaunted "scientific method" or Haaaaaaavaaaaaahd's "scientific method?"

US polls indicate that most of the amateur skeptics are Republicans. These Republican skeptics should wonder how presidential candidate John McCain could have been taken in.

Because Juan McCain is an idiot demagogue. As is apparently the author of this opinion piece.

4 posted on 08/04/2008 5:15:35 AM PDT by sauropod (What do Osama and Obama have in common? They both have friends that bombed the Pentagon.)
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To: AU72
THE FEW climate-change "skeptics" with any sort of scientific credentials

WTF? Has this guy recently fallen off of the turnip truck?

5 posted on 08/04/2008 5:16:36 AM PDT by rjsimmon
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To: AU72
"It has delayed - and continues to delay - the development of the political consensus that will be needed if society is to embrace remedies commensurate with the challenge."

In other words - Socialism. This has nothing to do with climate change and everything to do with social change.

Until people wake up and realize that these people want to take away the American Dream from all of us "for the greater good" of those who haven't earned it we will allow ourselves to be stripped of our freedoms.

(FRCDH) (BITS)

6 posted on 08/04/2008 5:18:16 AM PDT by Abathar (Proudly posting without reading the article carefully since 2004)
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To: AU72

“THE FEW climate-change “skeptics” with any sort of scientific credentials ...”

I submit confirmation of my theory that numbers are not friends of liberals. I guess this journalism major thinks that a some thousands of folks (all with educations far beyond this reporter’s meager mental ability) is a “few”.

What a maroon.


7 posted on 08/04/2008 5:18:55 AM PDT by Da Coyote
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To: AU72

He puts forward no evidence that climate change is man-made. He’s is just guessing.


8 posted on 08/04/2008 5:18:56 AM PDT by Bulwinkle
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To: sauropod
I accept the fact that we have climate change and we have names for it, Spring, Summer, Fall and Winter.

In Western PA, the temperature range is more than 100 degrees in a single year, and we sweat in the Summer, freeze in the Winter and adapt to all the changes using clothes and heat and air conditioning.

9 posted on 08/04/2008 5:20:57 AM PDT by USS Alaska (Nuke the terrorist savages - In Honor of Standing Wolf)
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THE FEW climate-change "skeptics" with any sort of scientific credentials

31,000 Scientists Shatter the Myth of "Scientific Consensus" on Global Warming

John P. Holdren's role model.


10 posted on 08/04/2008 5:21:30 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham
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To: AU72

Simple response on why all these notables advocate for the climate change man-caused model of intervention is “follow the money”. Which position offers more grants, more conferences and travels to exotic locations, more Nobels (and we all know how relevant those are now), more usurping of power over the people, more anointing of the “Knowledgeable Ones”?


11 posted on 08/04/2008 5:23:15 AM PDT by caseinpoint (Don't get thickly involved in thin things)
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To: rjsimmon
“Climate” has always changed. About 12,000 years ago the last ice age ended without the help of mankind. It was substantially warmer 62 million years ago prior to the demise of the dinosaurs than it is now. We found coal deposits in Antarctica. There are coal deposits in the Arctic regions.
12 posted on 08/04/2008 5:23:59 AM PDT by Citizen Tom Paine (Swift as the wind; Calmly majestic as a forest; Steady as the mountains.)
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To: AU72
well at least the globe and it's parent company the new york times are doing their part by printing less and less newspapers every month

of course that is only because fewer and fewer people believe their liberal drivel but its a start.

13 posted on 08/04/2008 5:25:28 AM PDT by edzo4
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To: AU72
First, they have not come up with any plausible alternative culprit for the disruption of global climate that is being observed, for example, a culprit other than the greenhouse-gas buildups in the atmosphere that have been measured and tied beyond doubt to human activities. (The argument that variations in the sun's output might be responsible fails a number of elementary scientific tests.)

Second, having not succeeded in finding an alternative, they haven't even tried to do what would be logically necessary if they had one, which is to explain how it can be that everything modern science tells us about the interactions of greenhouse gases with energy flow in the atmosphere is wrong.

The guy has "beyond doubt", failed a number of "elementary scientific tests" like examining all the evidence. Second, he suffers from strawman syndrome; everything is not wrong, some parts are correct, and some are theoretical speculation (e.g. sensitivity, catastrophic climate change). Third, he suffers from physics myopia, there's a lot more to climate than energy flow in the atmosphere.

14 posted on 08/04/2008 5:26:38 AM PDT by palmer (Tag lines are an extra $1)
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To: AU72

Funny, He didn’t provide a single piece of evidence.


15 posted on 08/04/2008 5:28:54 AM PDT by Soliton (> 100)
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To: Bulwinkle

“He puts forward no evidence that climate change is man-made. He’s is just guessing.”

Of course he doesnt...there isnt any.


16 posted on 08/04/2008 5:30:22 AM PDT by Prysson
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To: Bulwinkle
"He puts forward no evidence that climate change is man-made. He’s is just guessing."

I'd like to see idiots like this take the argument one step further, and tell us all in great detail, how hundreds of billions of dollars are going to change the temperature maybe one tenth of a percent (which of course could be attributed to a natural occurrence anyway).

Oh, gee, well ok then! Check's in the mail genius. Don't spend it all in one place.

I'm going to start a global climate change business. They send me a trillion bucks and I'll fix this. Guaranteed.

So if after ten years I haven't make a difference then I'll refund 100% of the trillion bucks.

17 posted on 08/04/2008 5:31:47 AM PDT by libs_kma (NOBAMA. Keep the change)
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To: Bulwinkle

That’s because there IS no evidence. Not real evidence, just computer scenarios which seem to bear minimal to no relationship to empirical readings. If you look at most of the believers arguments they seem to hinge not in science on attacking the opposition.

Anyway, how they have the hide to try to scare us about man made “global warming” when its been cooling for about 6 years and even the alarmists admit that it will probably continue to do so for at least another 10 is beyond me.

What I do find, though, is that people who haven’t given it a great deal of thought suppport their position simply because they want to do their bit to reduce pollution. Just try telling them that CO2 is not a pollutant. All you get is a blank stare.


18 posted on 08/04/2008 5:31:58 AM PDT by Nipfan
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To: AU72
THE FEW climate-change "skeptics" with any sort of scientific credentials continue to receive attention in the media out of all proportion to their numbers, their qualifications, or the merit of their arguments.

This article is not about "convincing" climate change skeptics. It is about silencing them!

The author uses simple-minded strawman arguments, ignores the merits of the issues raised by AGW skeptics (except when sneering at these self-same merits), and generally fails to preach to anyone but the chori director.

The author is a putz.

19 posted on 08/04/2008 5:32:05 AM PDT by MortMan (Those who stand for nothing fall for anything. - Alexander Hamilton)
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To: Soliton
Funny, He didn’t provide a single piece of evidence.

"It's settled science!", "The debate is over!".

He's telling us morons to go back to our guns and religion and leave the thinking to the elite.

20 posted on 08/04/2008 5:33:36 AM PDT by AU72
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