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To: x
Do you really, really believe that we'd have equal civil rights regardless of skin color to the degree that we do today in an independent Confederacy?

Sir or Mam. I do not believe such existed in the United States for quite some time afterward even up into the 1960's. The north was as prejudiced as the south in some cases maybe more so. Despite all the horror stories you hear about the south, black and whites got along as good if not better than they did in the north. There were exceptions. But I remember the north had it's riots also. BTW that was before the ones in the 1960's began. Like the turn of the century perhaps or a decade or two afterward?

A nice fantasy, but most of the secessionist leaders didn't want to develop industries. They say their new country as a vast agrarian Confederacy. Remember Wigfall?

A few didn't want industrialization and most wanted a stronger south. What they did not want was a forced take over which still came anyway. If they had not have wanted an industrialized the south would not have been as far along as it was.

284 posted on 08/28/2007 2:20:08 PM PDT by cva66snipe (Proud Partisan Constitution Supporting Conservative to which I make no apologies for nor back down)
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To: cva66snipe
The north was as prejudiced as the south in some cases maybe more so. Despite all the horror stories you hear about the south, black and whites got along as good if not better than they did in the north.

Nobody much got along with anyone else up here.

But I was talking about basic civil rights -- the right to vote, the right to a fair trial, protection from mob violence, non-descrimination in public facilities and employment.

It's a hypothetical question, but do you really think we'd have come as far as we have if the Confederates had won?

But I remember the north had it's riots also. BTW that was before the ones in the 1960's began. Like the turn of the century perhaps or a decade or two afterward?

There were race riots during and after the first World War in Northern cities. What's curious is that people generally are aware of riots that happened in Chicago, Detroit or New York. For a long time, earlier race riots in Wilmington NC and Atlanta were forgotten.

But my point was that it's a mistake to pretend that it was only Lincoln or the Civil War or Reconstruction that complicated and embittered relations between Blacks and Whites. Even if Whites had fond feelings for specific African-Americans they knew, they resisted mixing and sharing power.

I suppose that was true in both North and South, but the ugly side was more pronounced in the South. Maybe that's because Blacks were more numerous in the South. Anyway, you have to take the good with the bad: close personal relationships, together with a good deal of oppression.

368 posted on 08/29/2007 3:56:13 PM PDT by x
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