Again: Pope Francis Supports Controversial Milagro Sala

Gloria TV ^ | May 26, 2017 | Gloria TV

[ebb tide]

Again: Pope Francis Supports Controversial Milagro Sala

On Wednesday, Pope Francis sent a handwritten letter of support to the Argentinean left-wing activist Milagro Sala, the imprisoned leader of the association Tupac Amaru which receives monthly 1,9 Million Dollars from the Argentinean government for different social projects. Among others, Tupac Amaru provides for contraception and free abortions and promotes homosexualism and gender ideology.

In January 2016 Sala was arrested on charges of fraud and criminal conspiracy. She allegedly embezzlement over 1,8 Million U.S. Dollar intended to help the poor. Shortly after her arrest Francis sent her a rosary. Sala considers the Communist Che Guevara or Socialist Bolivian President Evo Morales as her political models. She is criticised for her lust of power, autocratic behaviour, and violent temper.

Sala calls herself a "Catholic in my way" and believes in indigenous paganism and shamans. In September 2014 she met Francis in the Vatican and presented him with coca leaves, which are internationally prohibited.

[ebb tide]

How are direct quotes of the heretic, Martin Luther, not “exacting”?

[ebb tide]

I intend to explain (and provide multiple links, and quotes) later, but for now, I simply don't have the several hours extra it would take to soundly refute the nonsense you've been barking.

I'll be ready for you, with many more quotes of the heretic.

[Walkingfeather]

windswept house...

[ebb tide]

Msgr. Patrick F. O'Hare, LL.D., was an American priest and author of the nineteenth and twentieth centuries. His extensive work entitled The Facts about Luther was originally published by the Frederick Pustet Company, Ohio, in 1916. In it, Father O'Hare examines every important aspect of Luther's life and work to make known the truth about the legendary figure, through many of Luther's own words. The book received the Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur upon publication, and was retypeset from the revised edition in 1987. The Facts about Luther was retypeset once again by TAN Books in 2007.

[ebb tide]

Using primarily non-Catholic sources, O’Hare details assiduously the historic facts about Luther, his teachings, and the ever-splintering, disunited Protestant world he fathered. The real Luther is exposed through his writings, sermons, and letters, along with the testimony of his pupils, close friends, contemporaries, and Protestant biographers. Most of the common beliefs about Luther are blown away, revealed convincingly as myths made of the sands of romanticism and propaganda.

“We will then write about Luther, not against him,” says O’Hare. "We will quote his own words. If the result is not favorable to him, the fault will not be ours.”

“My word,” said Luther, “is the word of Christ; my mouth is the mouth of Christ.” It is one of history’s great ironies that “the mouth of Christ” stands condemned by his own words.

O’Hare states: “We have no intention to wound the convictions and sensibilities of any in the community who may disagree with us. Our aim is to tell the truth about the standard-bearer of the Reformation, and of this no one should be afraid, for truth and virtue triumph by their own inherent beauty and power.”

[BlueDragon]

I'll be ready for you, with many more quotes of the heretic.

After reading what I'll send you to, it is yourself who should not be quoting Martin Luther, at least not in second-hand fashion through persons such as O/Hare, who clearly has an agenda to demonize Luther.

When, or if you do care to quote Luther, see to it that the quotes are linked to direct sources. Second-hand citations from the likes of Father O’Hare are unreliable, non-direct, and clearly biased translation source for quotes.

For some of the worst alleged quotes, among the worst O'Hare haphazardly documented, when he documented his sources at all(!)-- Luther is very often attributed to having said this-or-that according to somebody's notes rather than Luther's own writings, ---all of which was written originally in German, which then at the hands of Roman Catholics seeking to tear him down, have long been subject to selectively biased cherry-picking in order to make it all look worse than it was ---including when Luther was possibly at his worst. That makes those particular [alleged] citations into "hearsay" witness testimony of the worst second-hand, and third-hand kind. O'Hare had lots of those, and is indeed a primary source among present-day RC apologists who seek to demonize Luther, rather than understand what was more actually being said, and why.

The man was under a great deal of pressure. Is it any surprise that he would have experienced difficulties? Roman Catholicism, more acutely in Luther's era than our own, was chock-full of theological stumbling blocks which were not Christ (the true cornerstone) but were instead inventions of mere men who mistook their own imaginings to be equal to the Word of God.

Dealing with RC apologists (and their twisted-up multi-layered errors, and lies, coupled with personal attacks) as long as I have, I could only imagine the strain Luther was under to, theologically speaking, get it right --in a time when there was a great deal of theological outlook and practice that itself would have been viewed as heretical, had the original apostles and their first few generations of successors witnessed the theological developments. Myself and others here on this forum have been addressing those [ahem, cough-cough] developments for YEARS, by now.

Are you interested in the truth about Luther, ebbtide? Or, are you more interested in repeating twisted-up accusations, and poorly-sourced quotes? Answer that, and then we could proceed.

[ebb tide]

Two things for you to consider:

1. It was not I who brought up Luther on this thread. It was your “dragon” buddy who, out of the blue, quoted the arch-hereitc Luther in an attack on the papacy in his post #8.

2. I never quoted Fr. Patrick O’Hare; I quoted your hero’s words directly with a source: De Servo Arbitrio.

So good luck refuting your very own arch-heretic, Martin Luther. You guys have your work cut out for you.

Who’s in you saddle? God or Satan?

[ebb tide]

The man was under a great deal of pressure.

No kidding?

Man must persuade himself that he has nothing to do with the law and that no sins can condemn him; nay, let him, so to say, boast of his sinfulness and thus take the weapon out of the devil’s hand. When the devil rushes at you and tries to drown you in the flood and the deluge of your sins … say to him, ‘Why do you wish to make a saint of me, why do you expect to find justice in me, who has nothing but sins and most grievous ones?’  (Wittenb. V. 281 B.)

Guess who rode in Luther's saddle until his death. I'll give you a hint; It wasn't God.

[BlueDragon]

How are direct quotes of the heretic, Martin Luther, not “exacting”?

Provide sources (and links) where the guy can be quoted in his own (fair English translation) words.

We'll need to see if Luther actually said the things you are claiming he did or if it's something else. Context can be important, too.

[ebb tide]

Go for it. Disprove my direct quotes of you your arch-heretic.

[ebb tide]

Here’s a good starting point for you:

https://www.amazon.com/Arbitrio-Enslaved-Bondage-Active-Contents-ebook/dp/B00654UL9U

[BlueDragon]

I asked you a question. You failed to answer it. Instead, you handed out stuff like this;

I never quoted Fr. Patrick O’Hare

Get real.

You did tell dragonbluster to read a book entitled “The Facts about Luther”, or else not comment on Luther, as if that book was authoritative.

A book of that name was written by a Roman Catholic priest [so-called] named Patrick O'Hare.

Every other supposed quote from Luther you've not attributed who was claiming Luther said such things ---and from what writing, and in what context a particular thing supposedly was said, etc.

I quoted your hero’s words directly with a source: De Servo Arbitrio.

That writing is in German. What's your source for the alleged quotes?

Meanwhile, papacy itself, as known by the Latin Church, is a heresy. Interestingly enough, you seem to not accept the present occupant of the office is a genuine 'Pope'.

You guys have your work cut out for you.

Too funny.

In light of your otherwise well enough known positions, what a joke the arguments you're trying to make are. Badly sourced, contradictory, and ultimately self defeating.

[BlueDragon]

If the Cardinals choose another putrid Marxist, repeat steps above.

Ah- so. The Holy Spirit does not select Latin Church popes.

People have been trying to point that out, for how long now? maybe...the year 1054, perhaps even earlier?

Like they say, confession is good for the soul.

Neil Diamond - Holly Holy [not a church song, but borrowed gospel music feel & style]

[BlueDragon]

Go for it. Disprove my direct quotes of you your arch-heretic.

You your? And that uh, you-your Pope, Francis the talking Francis? A heretic? Yes, or no?

Luther is said to have written approximately 60,000 pages...
If claiming to be quoting Luther "directly" you'll need to provide more specific details. Second-hand, and third-hand quotes, coming from who knows where, are not sufficient.

Posting a link to Amazon.com is also insufficient. I don't play go fetch.

If you think I should go to Amazon.com, and buy a book in order to search out proof for your own argument-- then at the least, you could read a few links through, when I post them to you?

Will you?

Yes, or no?

Here, try these;

Defending O'Hare's Facts About Luther: A Roman defender attempts to give credence to one of the worst books on Luther ever written.

Defending O'Hare's Facts About Luther (Continued)- A Roman defender gives up defending one of the worst books on Luther ever written.

Roman Apologist Art Sippo on Father O’Hare’s “Facts About Luther”"> - Catholic apologist Art Sippo says do not read The Facts About Luther.

*after the link(s) is Swan's own brief description*

[i'd wager i'll need to spoon-feed it...and the, ah, babies will keep turning their faces away, refusing to eat. i hate it when that happens...]

[ebb tide]

I gave you direct quotes of Luther.

You have only provided second and third-hand quotes. If you think a book authored by Martin Luther is not good enough for you, I can’t help you.

You’re not fooling anyone.

[ebb tide]

You are quoting a Luther worshiper’s website who quotes a Catholic medical doctor who is not qualified in theology nor apologetics.

I have been quoting Luther directly and providing you with a source to them.

As I said, you are are not fooling anyone.

[ebb tide]

And that uh, you-your Pope, Francis the talking Francis? A heretic? Yes, or no?

Yes

If you want to continue in your pathetic attempt at a defense of Luther, start a new thread. It wasn't I who brought him up on this thread.

[Arthur McGowan]

“People have been trying to point that out...”

I have pointed it out many times right here on FR.

The Catholic Church has NEVER taught that God chooses the Pope.

[ebb tide]

That's not a man

Baby!

[ebb tide]

The body with its members has to be subject to the law, it has to carry its burden like a donkey, but leave the donkey with its burden in the valley when you ascend the mountain. For the conscience has nothing to do with law, works, earthly justice. We want indeed ‘the light of the Evangelium’ to understand this, and in this light the meaning is: ‘Keep the law, by all means; but if you do not, you need not be troubled in your conscience, for the transgression of the law cannot possibly condemn you.’  (Wittenb. V. 304.)

Go ahead. Look it up.