Posted on 05/03/2015 12:05:34 PM PDT by RnMomof7
Pope Stephen VI (896–897), who had his predecessor Pope Formosus exhumed, tried, de-fingered, briefly reburied, and thrown in the Tiber.[1]
Pope John XII (955–964), who gave land to a mistress, murdered several people, and was killed by a man who caught him in bed with his wife.
Pope Benedict IX (1032–1044, 1045, 1047–1048), who "sold" the Papacy
Pope Boniface VIII (1294–1303), who is lampooned in Dante's Divine Comedy
Pope Urban VI (1378–1389), who complained that he did not hear enough screaming when Cardinals who had conspired against him were tortured.[2]
Pope Alexander VI (1492–1503), a Borgia, who was guilty of nepotism and whose unattended corpse swelled until it could barely fit in a coffin.[3]
Pope Leo X (1513–1521), a spendthrift member of the Medici family who once spent 1/7 of his predecessors' reserves on a single ceremony[4]
Pope Clement VII (1523–1534), also a Medici, whose power-politicking with France, Spain, and Germany got Rome sacked.
As regards the oft-quoted Mt. 16:18
• Augustine, sermon:
"Christ, you see, built his Church not on a man but on Peter's confession. What is Peter's confession? 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' There's the rock for you, there's the foundation, there's where the Church has been built, which the gates of the underworld cannot conquer. — John Rotelle, O.S.A., Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine , © 1993 New City Press, Sermons, Vol III/6, Sermon 229P.1, p. 327
Upon this rock, said the Lord, I will build my Church. Upon this confession, upon this that you said, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God,' I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not conquer her (Mt. 16:18). — John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City, 1993) Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 236A.3, p. 48.
• Augustine, sermon:
For petra (rock) is not derived from Peter, but Peter from petra; just as Christ is not called so from the Christian, but the Christian from Christ. For on this very account the Lord said, 'On this rock will I build my Church,' because Peter had said, 'Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.' On this rock, therefore, He said, which thou hast confessed, I will build my Church. For the Rock (Petra) was Christ; and on this foundation was Peter himself built. For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Christ Jesus. The Church, therefore, which is founded in Christ received from Him the keys of the kingdom of heaven in the person of Peter, that is to say, the power of binding and loosing sins. For what the Church is essentially in Christ, such representatively is Peter in the rock (petra); and in this representation Christ is to be understood as the Rock, Peter as the Church. — Augustine Tractate CXXIV; Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers: First Series, Volume VII Tractate CXXIV (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf107.iii.cxxv.html)
• Augustine, sermon:
And Peter, one speaking for the rest of them, one for all, said, You are the Christ, the Son of the living God (Mt 16:15-16)...And I tell you: you are Peter; because I am the rock, you are Rocky, Peter-I mean, rock doesn't come from Rocky, but Rocky from rock, just as Christ doesn't come from Christian, but Christian from Christ; and upon this rock I will build my Church (Mt 16:17-18); not upon Peter, or Rocky, which is what you are, but upon the rock which you have confessed. I will build my Church though; I will build you, because in this answer of yours you represent the Church. — John Rotelle, O.S.A. Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1993), Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 270.2, p. 289
• Augustine, sermon:
Peter had already said to him, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' He had already heard, 'Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jona, because flesh and blood did not reveal it to you, but my Father who is in heaven. And I tell you, that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of the underworld shall not conquer her' (Mt 16:16-18)...Christ himself was the rock, while Peter, Rocky, was only named from the rock. That's why the rock rose again, to make Peter solid and strong; because Peter would have perished, if the rock hadn't lived. — John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City, 1993) Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 244.1, p. 95
• Augustine, sermon:
...because on this rock, he said, I will build my Church, and the gates of the underworld shall not overcome it (Mt. 16:18). Now the rock was Christ (1 Cor. 10:4). Was it Paul that was crucified for you? Hold on to these texts, love these texts, repeat them in a fraternal and peaceful manner. — John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1995), Sermons, Volume III/10, Sermon 358.5, p. 193
• Augustine, Psalm LXI:
Let us call to mind the Gospel: 'Upon this Rock I will build My Church.' Therefore She crieth from the ends of the earth, whom He hath willed to build upon a Rock. But in order that the Church might be builded upon the Rock, who was made the Rock? Hear Paul saying: 'But the Rock was Christ.' On Him therefore builded we have been. — Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers (Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1956), Volume VIII, Saint Augustin, Exposition on the Book of Psalms, Psalm LXI.3, p. 249. (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf108.ii.LXI.html)
• Augustine, in “Retractions,”
In a passage in this book, I said about the Apostle Peter: 'On him as on a rock the Church was built.'...But I know that very frequently at a later time, I so explained what the Lord said: 'Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church,' that it be understood as built upon Him whom Peter confessed saying: 'Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God,' and so Peter, called after this rock, represented the person of the Church which is built upon this rock, and has received 'the keys of the kingdom of heaven.' For, 'Thou art Peter' and not 'Thou art the rock' was said to him. But 'the rock was Christ,' in confessing whom, as also the whole Church confesses, Simon was called Peter. But let the reader decide which of these two opinions is the more probable. — The Fathers of the Church (Washington D.C., Catholic University, 1968), Saint Augustine, The Retractations Chapter 20.1:.
That's happened to me more than once...Accused of misinterpreting the scripture and directed me to search the catechism for the correct interpretation...
And when showing their catechism agreed with me and the scriptures, I was told that I need someone to interpret their catechism for me...
These people can take a trip without ever leaving the farm...
OK, I did...And no thanks...
And the best part......we used catholic sources to prove it!
You can't make this stuff up.
Well.....maybe catholics can (and do), but you get the idea!
Done for tonight.
Likewise...
A lot of faithfull Catholics are on a lifelong pride trip so they are constantly trying to lift up the teachings they have received and how “right” it is.
I never ask either, but I suspect there may be more than one or two in my fellowship. As far I can remember, I don't think any priest or nun ever told me not to read the Bible. My parents, however, did. Being as I was a totally rebellious person, 😎 I did the opposite. I used to sneak our old family Catholic Bible into my room, after I wiped off a half inch layer of dust, and read it myself. I wanted to know why I felt certain I was lost and on my way to Hell. No one could tell me why, so I figured I would try to figure out life's greatest mystery on my own. The rest, as they say, is history. Keep up the good work.
:-)
“Matthew 16:18-20 Those verses should clarify things for you.’
ROLOTHFL! You have to bee kidding, Imp...There is nothing there to put Peter on any Roman Throne...
They'll need some cereal with their coffee; too!
JOHN 20
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19 On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being shut where the disciples were, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, "Peace be with you."
20 When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord.
21 Jesus said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you."
22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit.
23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained."
“It is sad that you feel the need to concern yourself with the Catholic Church’s beliefs. I have never met any Catholic who concerns themselves one jot about the authority or in your case the lack of historic authority of the protestants prior to the 1500s. For what reason would any Catholic ever care? Alternatively why would any protestant ever care?”
When one sees all the posts on this forum ‘in defense’ of Catholic positions, sometimes it is necessary to rebut to protect this forum and it’s position of representing the truth.
I believe everything that Holy Scripture says. I do not believe that your interpretation is correct. I have posted much on that and you have been copied. You should know what I KNOW and BELIEVE. Catholic ‘theology’ does not obliterate he truth.
So I ask you again....do you believe the scripture in 114?
Makes one wonder why some people think returning the nation to common Christian principals isn't at least as important as throwing rocks at others who at the very least accept Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior.
It's almost as if some people are afraid that the current attack on marriage may well be enough to finally get Christians to work together rather than fighting one another and can't stand the thought of that happening.
Makes one wonder why some people think returning the nation to common Christian principals isn't at least as important as throwing rocks at others who at the very least accept Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior.
Since you used the word "folks" in the first half, I assume you do not believe they are "Christians", as that label only gets applied to the group in the second half. And to emphasize the claim, you are actually accusing the first group with intentionally keeping Christians from getting together.
What do you believe defines the "common ground" and "common Christian principles" that Christians should get together on? Please tell us what you yourself did today, to "get Christians together on common ground to try and resist the wave of diabolical delusion sweeping our nation".
Should all Christians vote like Catholics?
But it never happened, did it...You can't cite a single case of of one man ever retaining the sins of another in the scriptures...And obviously you and your religion have no idea why...Yet you constantly post this scripture as tho it's supposed to mean something to you...
One of the cross references for those verses is:
Mat 19:27 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed thee; what shall we have therefore?
Mat 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
And clearly those scriptures are a complete mystery to you guys as well...I don't even have to look in your catechism to know that your religion didn't even comment on that scripture...It's a mystery to them as well...
Again, the blind leading the blind...
At some point in time, the apostles will judge people...But not yet...
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