Pay No Attention to That Man Behind the Curtain! Catholic History and the Emerald City Protocol

reformation21 ^ | April 2012 | Carl Trueman

[Karl Spooner]

Notarized with a signature would be important with your track record also.

[Elsie]

It comes down to this: IYHO, which is the cream of the crop?

[Elsie]

Before Internet porn, we had anonymous voices behind screens.

Musta been rough, listening to that stuff...

[metmom]

Well, evidently He wants everyone but Pharaoh...and Esau...and Judas...and Simon the Sorcerer...and

Somehow, that doesn't fit with it being God's will that all men be saved and come to repentance.

God gave pharaoh plenty of chances.

God created man in His image for relationship with Him, God takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked.

Ezekiel 18:32 For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Lord GOD; so turn, and live.”

[metmom]

Lurking:You won’t hear about it but the number if advances by both men and women on the priest is supposed to be distressing which is why priests will rarely have face to face with any woman,

KS:So now I take it that you now apologize to Metmon for calling her a "liar"?

Especially since the *mom* part of *metmom* gives a clue that I am indeed a woman.....

[Elsie]

Do you even know what you write from one post to another?

Sometimes I don't!

When I get a FReepmail that says, "I didn't like what you said there."

Or "I DID like what you said there."; I usually have NO clue as to what they are referring to since FReepmail does NOT contain the reply number it was sent from.

[Karl Spooner]

Evidently, it was a hostile post. God will take care of it.

[metmom]

So I’m NOT lying .....ooops ..... er.... making *falsehoods* about not having face to face confession after all, eh?

[Elsie]

Yet some still wonder about ELSIE...

[Karl Spooner]

Don’t you worry any, we and God will weed these phonies out. God even knows what they think!

[Elsie]

They merely have to search thru You've posted a total of 46 threads and 113,704 replies. items to find an answer...

[daniel1212]

I am almost 62, and in my days it was the “That Man Behind the Curtain” ...err screen in my youth, but now i recall latter doing face to face.

[annalex]

Latin is only contextually relevant if she believes Latin is the original language

Of course Salvation doesn't, -- no one is that ignorant. The relevance of Latin is that the English form, "full of grace" originates from Jerome's "gratia plena"; "κεχαριτωμενη" could indeed be translated by some other idiom related to the fullness, or possession, of grace as the Greek past participle does not have a direct grammatical parallel. St. Jerome found a simple way to translate it.

The point about Wycliffe's translation is that no Catholic would take it seriously, which explains why to Salvation and to most Catholics Douay is the first credible and professional English translation.

Eph 1:6

That would be "εχαριτωσεν", "graced", -- not the same neologism that St. Luke used to describe Mary. Obviously, derivatives of the word "χαρις" are plentiful, yet this particular one is unique. Surely nothing justifies the sleazy Protestant "highly favored".

tell us how Gregory and popes speaking infallibly (and i understand the criteria for such) are inspired by the Holy Ghost, so that God is the author of these infallible statements, if He is, and how this "dictation" is different from the Divine inspiration of Scripture.

The Holy Catholic Church generally is under the leadership of the Holy Ghost, not just popes, -- but of course not every time a prelate of the Church says something. However, when a doctor of the Church speaks on matters of faith and morals, his words are inspired by God.

the Paraclete, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you (John 14:26).

What sets the Holy Scripture apart from other teaching of the Magisterium is not that the Holy Scripture is the only inspired text, but that it is canonized by the Church to be inerrant and relate directly to the historical events surrounding Christ.

Infallibility of the Pope is different from both inspiration and canonicity as it pertains to the Pope's authority to settle disputes even among the bishops when the consensus is lacking.

Finally, it is a useful idiom do say instead of "inspired", "dictated by the Holy Ghost", but I am only aware of the expression used ex cathedra in Providentissimus Deus:

all the books which the Church receives as sacred and canonical, are written wholly and entirely, with all their parts, at the dictation of the Holy Ghost

Leo XIII on the inerrancy of scripture (from Providentissimus Deus) [ecum.].

you do not even have a list of all infallible teachings

Of course not. This is akin to telling us when Christ will come again: not useful knowledge. Whether formally and canonically binding as dogma or not, any uttering of the Magisterium is to be met with serious attention, and if formulated as definitive, with obedience. You exhibit the typical Protestant legalistic thinking that confuses the Holy Church with a police station.

Rome really believes is

Ask, and you will learn.

[Karl Spooner]

Don’t go PC on us. Count how many times you done it as compared to...

[daniel1212]

When I get a FReepmail that says, "I didn't like what you said there." Or "I DID like what you said there."; I usually have NO clue as to what they are referring to since FReepmail does NOT contain the reply number it was sent from.

This is too often true, and it does not go html for italics. So i often include the text being responded to as >"When I get a FReepmail that says "<

[annalex]

would make God the author of such extraScriptural writings, and infallible papal statements

Of course God is the author of all that is good. The canonicity of scripture means that this is a material (1) directly related to the historical events surrounding Jesus Christ; (2) written by an apostle or a person equally connected to the person of Christ; (3) is inerrant; (4) was used in the Holy Liturgy of the Early Church.

[annalex]

It is proving that “dictation of the Holy Ghost” is a belief of the Holy Catholic Church.

[LurkingSince'98]

The difference between you and metmom is that you don’t seem like the type to make flat out and absolute assertions like she did especially and specifically to contradict what I just posted.

It seems you are more circumspect and ask more questions.

You probably deduced for yourself that what you may have heard growing up in a Catholic neighborhood does not make you an expert.

Now the egregiousness of metmom statement is SHE SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER, yet she open up her mouth to contradict a faithful Catholic.

As I mentioned to another poster, most of the arguments even when they get vehement it is all quoting scripture or the apostolic Fathers and the differences come down to interpretations - sometimes of the exact same quote.

I rarely this kind of breathless ‘oh I gotcha’.

For the Greater Glory of God

[Karl Spooner]

It is proving that “dictation of the Holy Ghost” is a belief of the Holy Catholic Church.

Do Holy people worship dead bodies on display?

[metmom]

It is proving that “dictation of the Holy Ghost” is a belief of the Holy Catholic Church.

It *proves* nothing.

Anyone simply looking at that image would not have a clue what it is about without someone telling them.

Any image that is going to be instructional, especially to uneducated masses, needs to be clear enough to be understood without being *interpreted* for them by someone else.

If the message is not intuitive, then it has not been presented well enough.

In that picture, there's absolutely no way that someone could intuitively know that that was *Gregory the Great* or what he was doing except some guy was writing something.