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>> Paul explains that the promises were not made to 'SEEDS' as in plural or many, but to ONLY ONE SEED, which is Christ.<<

Which promises? It wasn’t the covenant about the land. Even if it was you wouldn’t be able to get around the fact that Christ will rule on the physical land of Canaan.

>> Therefore, as a seed of Abraham through Christ, I am making my claim at this time to a share of all the promises to Abraham and his seed, as should every Christian.<<

You and the Mormons have a serious problem with that approach. Which of the tribes out of which God will take the remnant of 144,000 are you?

>> They are back together under one King, whose name is Christ, whose throne is in heaven, which will forever be located in heaven.<<

Please show us from scripture where the land of Canaan is in heaven.

>>>It wasn’t the covenant about the land.<<<

That is really good to hear from a dispensationalist. Until this time I thought the so-called land covenant was a major tenet of dispensationalism that could not be denied.

>>>Even if it was you wouldn’t be able to get around the fact that Christ will rule on the physical land of Canaan.<<<

LOL! You mean the Lord who uses the earth at his footstool?

"Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest?" (Acts 7:49)

Or the Lord who ruleth over the entire universe from this throne in heaven?

"The Lord hath prepared his throne in the heavens; and his kingdom ruleth over all." (Ps 103:19)

Nowhere in the scripture does it say that Christ will physically rule from an earthly throne, temple, or in any other earthly manner. To the contrary, Christ plainly stated:

"…My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence." (John 18:36)

What does Jesus have to say to convince you?

My ancestors made it up that notion of the restoration of the earthly throne of David; not because they were concerned about the future of Israel; but because they were selfish, mean, arrogant little creeps. They would not listen to the prophets (or they killed them so they couldn’t listen to them.) And now the offspring of that same, ungodly bunch (along with their modern-day tag-team partners, the dispensationalists,) are again living in that make-believe world where they believe they, the "Jews," will rule the world! I promise you from the bottom of my heart: you do not want them ruling the world. Of course, you think you are going to be "raptured" before all that takes place, so why worry?

Forget about it. It will not happen the way you believe. Christ (who only is Holy) will never be seen in the flesh, again:

"Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: Of sin, because they believe not on me; Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged." (John 16:7-11 KJV)

It doesn't get any clearer than that.

If you are still not convinced, why did Christ send his angel to talk to John about writing the book of the Revelation, rather than come in the flesh, Himself? It was only about 30 years after his ascension?

Philip

>>>Philip, you keep going back to your alagorized vesion using passages that don’t address the land of Canaan. You cannot just brush that aside as if it doesn’t exist. <<<

I would request you refrain from ignoring the scriptures I post. Also, would you please keep the size of your fonts down to post-pre-school sizes?

These are my interpretations, again. Please read them:

"Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?" (Romans 9:21)

Oh, that wasn't it. Go ahead and ponder that verse while I look for the others.

"O house of Israel, cannot I do with you as this potter? saith the Lord. Behold, as the clay is in the potter's hand, so are ye in mine hand, O house of Israel." (Jer 18:6)

Oh, that wasn't it, either. Bear with me, I will find it.

Oh, here it is. Before you read this passage, take note that these were some of the Lord's instructions to Israel regarding their land covenant (whether you want to believe it or not.) The Lord was very concerned about Israel being led astray by the idolatry of the inhabitants of Canaan (to no avail,) and therefore ordered Israel to drive them out, along with their idols:

"Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye are passed over Jordan into the land of Canaan; Then ye shall drive out all the inhabitants of the land from before you, and destroy all their pictures, and destroy all their molten images, and quite pluck down all their high places: And ye shall dispossess the inhabitants of the land, and dwell therein: for I have given you the land to possess it." (Num 33:51-53 KJV)

If you think for one minute that Israel could have ignored those instructions, and retained the land covenant over the long haul, you have been greatly deceived. In fact, to make it clear to Israel in no uncertain terms, their destiny if they ignored his instructions, the Lord said:

"But if ye will not drive out the inhabitants of the land from before you; then it shall come to pass, that those which ye let remain of them shall be pricks in your eyes, and thorns in your sides, and shall vex you in the land wherein ye dwell. Moreover it shall come to pass, that I shall do unto you, as I thought to do unto them." (Num 33:55-56 KJV)

And what had the Lord thought to do unto those nations that Israel was supposed to drive out? To destroy them:

"And it shall be, if thou do at all forget the Lord thy God, and walk after other gods, and serve them, and worship them, I testify against you this day that ye shall surely perish. As the nations which the Lord destroyeth before your face, so shall ye perish; because ye would not be obedient unto the voice of the Lord your God." (Deu 8:19-20 KJV)

Therefore, Israel forfeited it's right to the land of Canaan, or so it would seem. But, in reality, that promise, and all others made to Abraham, went to Christ, the seed of promise of Israel and Abraham. I know that is a hard concept: that Christ was the inheritor (the seed) of the promise (all of them;) but it is a fact.

Over the "long-haul," Israel became so corrupt with idolatry and man-made traditions, that many were no longer worshipping the Lord, but Satan. Jesus tried to make that clear in this passage:

"Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it." (John 8:44 KJV)

Philip

>>>You and the Mormons have a serious problem with that approach. Which of the tribes out of which God will take the remnant of 144,000 are you?<<<

ROFL! Aw, come on, Cynical Bear: you can smear better than that! I have seen you in action, and this smear is very weak! LOL!

Why don't we evaluate new-age vs old-age doctrines:

New-Age doctrines:

1) Millerism: evolved into Jehovah Witnesses and Seventh-Day Adventists

2) Mormanism

3) Dispensationalism

Did I leave any out? Now lets look at some of of the old-age, traditional doctrines. Let's start with the doctrine of a third-century fellow named Eusebius, called postmillennialism, which matches my doctrine mostly, and work from there:

1) Postmillennialism

2) Amillennialism

3) Historic Premillennialism

I may have left a few out.

BTW, I was thoroughly and completely amused by your recent thread where you seemed to claim that the doctrine of dispensationalism had been hidden from the masses, or "veiled," until these "last days." That was wry humour, wasn't it?

You do know that Christ appeared on the earth during the last days, don't you; and that was about 2,000 years ago. Are we still in the last days, and how long will they last? How many Hal Lindsey books, loaded with false prophesies, do we have to endure? How many days are there after the Last Day?

This is a passage from the Hebrews that mentions that Christ was here in the last days:

"God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;" (Heb 1:1-2 KJV)

That is powerful stuff.

Philip

Correct, and not only that; their definition of this generation does not fit the number of years that elapsed. Caiaphas probably died in 36AD and Annas in 40 AD. Mothers had their children fairly young. While I grant the godly could live a long life, that would not logically apply to the scenario of the preterist having a generation for judgment in 70AD. Although it is possible some of the Sanhedrin that tried Yeshua could have been alive in 70AD (the youngest member may have been about 40 in 33AD/CE), it is unlikely that very many would have lived that long unless perhaps they had become believers.

However, there is a strong Scriptural argument for interpreting this generation as having applied to 70AD/CE that just dawn upon me. Forty hears after Yeshua's ministry began would be about 70AD/CE. This generation could have meant all those who were of the age twenty and upwards on or about 30AD/CE and had the opportunity to hear the Gospel. Forty years elapsed until 70AD/CE when they had either endured to the end in faith or perished in the First Jewish-Roman War. That generation of forty years was judged.

For the children of Israel walked forty years in the wilderness, till all the people that were men of war, which came out of Egypt, were consumed, because they obeyed not the voice of the LORD: unto whom the LORD sware that he would not shew them the land, which the LORD sware unto their fathers that he would give us, a land that floweth with milk and honey.

Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness: When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work. Forty years long was I grieved with this generation, and said, It is a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways: Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest.

Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice, Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness: When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years. Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways. So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.) Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation. For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses. But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness? And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not? So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.