Posted on 03/11/2012 2:20:23 PM PDT by NYer
Mormons like Glenn Beck and Senator Orrin Hatch have long given a high profile to this American-grown faith. And with Mitt Romney in the running for the Republican nomination, the question of exactly how to categorize Mormonism has become news. An Evangelical pastor who supports Rick Perry told reporters he thought Mormonism is “a cult”, prompting a denial of the opinion by the Perry campagn, and a characterization of it as “bigotry” by former member of the Reagan cabinet, Bill Bennett, speaking in support of Romney. Mormons, meanwhile, very openly express the hope that having a Mormon running in the presidential race will help people to see their religion as “mainstream.”
Mormons have been publicly asking to be accepted as “Christians” and have their church, “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints”, viewed as just another Christian denomination for decades now. But their own history makes this problematic. Their founder, Joseph Smith, claimed to have been told in a vision regarding the Christian churches that God “forbade me to join with any of them” and “all their creeds were an abomination in his sight.” It is hence Mormons (not Christians) who established, from the beginning of their group, an antagonistic relationship with those Christian groups already in existence, although in recent years Mormons have sought to downplay this antagonism. Still, even while they seem to be natural political and social allies with Evangelicals, many Evangelicals continue to refer to the Mormon faith as a “cult.” (To make it more confusing for a Catholic, some of these same Evangelicals might call the Catholic Church “a cult.”) Meanwhile, when Mormons are not trying to make common cause with Evangelicals, they will boldly challenge Catholics with their assertion that the Mormon church is the only true church.
In one sense, clearly, Mormonism is Christian. If you were going to categorize Mormonism according to world-religion criteria, you would have to say they are Christians. World religions are the major belief systems found around the world that frame a tradition of enough cultural richness to support a civilization. The major world religions are Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Shintoism, Confucianism and Islam. Clearly Mormonism fits into the broad “Christian” category. And so would many other groups whose relationship with the wider Christian world is antagonistic: Jehovah’s Witnesses, Oneness Pentecostals, etc.
Also, we have to remember that individual Mormons may be Christians in spite of being Mormons. Some Mormon converts were baptized as Christians at some point before becoming Mormons. So when we talk about whether Mormons are Christians, we really are talking about whether Mormonism as a belief system is Christian, not judging the faith claim of an individual.
America’s Lost Tribe
It may be that in the not-too-distant future, we will have to categorize Mormonism as a separate world religion. It is the fifth-largest religious group now in the US, having passed the Lutherans, and the LDS are experiencing rapid expansion in other countries. In many ways its development parallels that of Islam. Both religions were founded by prophets who claimed to have been visited by an angel. They borrow heavily from Judaism and Christianity, yet reject their central tenets. Both rely upon strange revisions of history. The Koran identifies Mary, the mother of Jesus, with Miriam the sister of Moses, who lived over fourteen centuries earlier. The Book of Mormon makes numerous claims regarding the peoples of the Americas (including the idea that the American Indians descended from a lost tribe of ancient Israelites) that have been refuted by history, archeology, and anthropology. Both Islam and Mormonism claim that where their sacred writings contradict the Bible, the Christian and Jewish scriptures have been corrupted.
It might be argued that Mormons have the right to say that they are “Christians” and no one should deny what they say about themselves. It is possible, however, for us to respect their right to call themselves whatever they wish without feeling compelled to validate that claim ourselves. This is complicated by the fact that to many Catholics, Mormonism seems no more strange than the Baptist faith, or that of any other Protestant denomination. In part this is because Mormons themselves generally use the language and terminology common to (especially Protestant) Christians. In their initial approach to you, they will do all they can to hide or gloss over the distinctive beliefs of their church. Statements of Mormon belief sound so much like statements of the Christian faith that many Catholics and Protestants are quite willing to recognize Mormons as “Christians,” not merely in the world-religion sense, but in the sense in which we Catholics recognize Protestant Christians as our “separated brethren.” This is a serious error with two major consequences.
First, Christians (including Catholics) are misled into the Mormon church where they are indoctrinated in a religion which rejects the central doctrines of the Christian faith, resulting in them bringing their children up as non-Christians. Second, Christians embrace Mormons as fellow Christians instead of evangelizing them.
In order to protect Christians from this deception and to help Mormons learn the truth, we must understand how Mormon doctrine differs from the historic Christian faith that we share with Protestants. To do this, we will examine first what Mormons say, then how they define the terms they are using and how that differs from the Christian faith. Finally we provide a biblical, Christian response and suggestions for how to discuss these things with a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
The Central Question: Who is God?
What Mormons will say they believe about God:
Why the Mormon God the Father is not the Christian God the Father:
Christian answer:
Jesus: Brother of Lucifer?
Why the Mormon Jesus is not the Christian Jesus:
Christian answer:
Why the Mormon doctrine of man is not the Christian doctrine of man:
Christian answer:
What is Salvation?
What Mormons will say they believe about salvation:
Why Mormon salvation is not Christian salvation:
Christian answer:
Why the Mormon hope is not the Christian hope:
Christian answer:
When Talking to a Mormon
Remember that the Mormon is trained to hide the difference between his beliefs and yours and to present himself as a Christian. However, his belief that he is a Christian is sincere, and his efforts to hide the distinctive of the Mormon religion are pursued in his desire to get you to accept Mormon teachings.
Do not allow glib, surface responses to go unchallenged; press the Mormon to define the Christian-sounding words he is using.
Define your own terms also. Draw the contrast for the Mormon. Calmly and clearly insist that what you and he believe about the nature of God, the identity of Jesus, the nature of man, salvation and eternal life are different. To pretend otherwise is dishonest.
Appeal to his honesty and sense of fairness. You might say, “Look, we are not going to get anywhere unless we are honest with each other. Without making any statement about which one of us is right, can’t we just acknowledge that we do not worship the same God?” or “Can’t we just acknowledge that we do not have the same hope for the future?”
Help the Mormon to consider the logical and philosophical problems with the Plan of Eternal Progression: If God had a Father and He had a Father and so on then who was the first God? Mormons say it is an “infinite regression.” But since there is no way to cross an infinite distance or pass an infinite amount of time, there would be no way to get to “now” and to “us” from an infinite past. Time has to have had a beginning and it did. It began with the creation “of all things seen and unseen” by God. Mormons say that God is omnipotent (almighty, all-powerful), yet they say there are many gods. There cannot be more than one omnipotent being, so the Mormon conception of God is shrunken and distorted.
A big selling point of the Mormon hope for the future is the idea that families will be together eternally. But if Mormons become Gods of planets and then their children become Gods of other planets how do the children and parents get together? Can a God leave his planet unattended while he goes to a celestial family reunion? This Mormon selling point would be diminished if we Christians were more vocal about our hope for the “new heavens and new earth” in which we know one another in the all the relationships of our present lives, only in glory (2 Pt 3:13; Rv 21:1).
Welcome the participation of Mormons in causes which we share for the common good: strengthening family life, fighting pornography and abortion, fostering the virtue of patriotism, and defending the Constitution. We honor each Mormon as a person who desires what is genuinely good for himself, his family and his society – and when we share the truths of the Christian faith with him.
[For more on the political implications of Mormonism see here.]
I would not want to be that MORMON, and thank PERSONAGES that the overwhelming amount of MORMONs in this world have not committed this sin and heresy. G-d forbid they should abandon Wilford Woodruff.
Please, learn about MORMONism. I dont mean this sarcastically; if you knew the truth about MORMONism and why MORMONs cannot accept POLYGAMY, then you would understand.
You have it backward.
They need to RENOUNCE the HATE SPEECH that THEIR 'religion' makes EVERY DAY toward Christianity.
You've only just replied to #1.
After you get to #53 and read it; please get back to me.
They will be cut off (EXCOMMUNICATED #2 ) from the MORMON community for their apostasy and will be considered APOSTATES.
I would not want to be that MORMON #3, and thank PERSONAGES that the overwhelming amount of MORMONs in this world have not committed this sin and heresy.
G-d forbid they should abandon Wilford Woodruff #4 .
The Doctrine and CovenantsSection 132Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Nauvoo, Illinois, recorded 12 July 1843, relating to the new and everlasting covenant, including the eternity of the marriage covenant, and also the plurality of wives (see History of the Church, 5:5017). Although the revelation was recorded in 1843, it is evident from the historical records that the doctrines and principles involved in this revelation had been known by the Prophet since 1831.
.
.
.
5866, Laws governing the plurality of wives are set forth.
58 Now, as touching the law of the apriesthood, there are many things pertaining thereunto. 59 Verily, if a man be called of my Father, as was aAaron, by mine own voice, and by the voice of him that bsent me, and I have endowed him with the ckeys of the power of this priesthood, if he do anything in my name, and according to my law and by my word, he will not commit dsin, and I will justify him. 60 Let no one, therefore, set on my servant Joseph; for I will justify him; for he shall do the sacrifice which I require at his hands for his transgressions, saith the Lord your God. 61 And again, as pertaining to the law of the priesthoodif any man espouse a virgin, and desire to espouse aanother, and the first give her consent, and if he espouse the second, and they are virgins, and have vowed to no other man, then is he justified; he cannot commit adultery for they are given unto him; for he cannot commit adultery with that that belongeth unto him and to no one else. 62 And if he have aten virgins given unto him by this law, he cannot commit adultery, for they belong to him, and they are given unto him; therefore is he justified. 63 But if one or either of the ten virgins, after she is espoused, shall be with another man, she has committed adultery, and shall be destroyed; for they are given unto him to amultiply and replenish the earth, according to my commandment, and to fulfil the promise which was given by my Father before the foundation of the world, and for their exaltation in the eternal worlds, that they may bear the souls of men; for herein is the work of my Father continued, that he may be bglorified. 64 And again, verily, verily, I say unto you, if any man have a wife, who holds the keys of this power, and he teaches unto her the law of my priesthood, as pertaining to these things, then shall she believe and administer unto him, or she shall be destroyed, saith the Lord your God; for I will destroy her; for I will magnify my name upon all those who receive and abide in my law. 65 Therefore, it shall be lawful in me, if she receive not this law, for him to receive all things whatsoever I, the Lord his God, will give unto him, because she did not believe and administer unto him according to my word; and she then becomes the transgressor; and he is exempt from the law of Sarah, who administered unto Abraham according to the law when I commanded Abraham to take aHagar to wife. 66 And now, as pertaining to this law, verily, verily, I say unto you, I will reveal more unto you, hereafter; therefore, let this suffice for the present. Behold, I am Alpha and Omega. Amen. |
...were excommunicated, and then started their own religion.
|
"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned; and I will go still further and say, take this revelation, or any other revelation that the Lord has given, and deny it in your feelings, and I promise that you will be damned. Brigham Young - JoD 3:266 (July 14, 1855) |
Inasmuch as laws have been enacted by Congress forbidding plural marriage...
I hereby declare my intention to submit to those laws..."
~ Wilford Woodruff, 4th LDS President |
Honest guys!
It wasn’t all red and large in the preview!
the conman choses evil on his own.
I respect your position, thanks!
G-d gives us salvation. G-d alone is the Rock and Redeemer.
There are plenty of Hebrew Scripture verses that prove it.
We Jews find the truth in Torah,not a man-god who may not have even lived.
Sorry to break the bad news to you,but when a Jew leaves the Torah behind to accept j*sus he/she is no longer a Jew and does not have the right to call themselves a Jew. They cannot call themselves a Jew.
They have been cut off by the Jewish community until they repent of the sin of idolatry and return to true Judaism.
WRONG!
I don’t want to worship j*sus anyway. He was angry,vindictive,he wanted revenge,etc.
Not befitting the true messiah.
Oh,did you know I used to be a c*ristian?
” Sorry to break the bad news to you,but when a Jew leaves the Torah behind to accept j*sus he/she is no longer a Jew and does not have the right to call themselves a Jew. They cannot call themselves a Jew.
They have been cut off by the Jewish community until they repent of the sin of idolatry and return to true Judaism.”
Do you have to stop being Jewish to believe in Jesus?
By David Sedaca
Although this question is frequently asked, many attempts to answer it are based on misconceptions or prejudices rather than pure facts. The simple answer to this question is that a person DOES NOT have to stop being Jewish to believe in Jesus. The reasons for this are as follows.
In first place, being Jewish is much more than being a practicing Jew. According to the American Jewish Congress, more than 50% of American Jews are either non-practicing, secular, humanistic, agnostic or atheist. But the remarkable fact is that those Jewish people are still considered Jews! So if religion does not define one’s “Jewishness,” why should the belief in Jesus change one’s “Jewish status”?
Another aspect of this question depends on who gives the answer. According to religious Jews, if a person chooses to believe in Jesus he has “crossed the line.” In other words, if a person chooses to believe in Jesus, he or she has made a conscious decision to become something other than a Jew.
But if Judaism is not defined by one’s beliefs, why should faith in Jesus automatically result in being cut off from the Jewish people? What can be more Jewish than believing that Jesus is the promised Jewish Messiah, who came to fulfill the Jewish prophecies as foretold in the Jewish Bible?
An erroneous view has also been held by the historical Christian churches from the middle of the third century to the present time. The fallacy is the belief that if a Jewish person wanted to follow Jesus, he or she had to forfeit their Jewishness and become a Gentile for all practical purposes.
The First Council of Nicaea, called by the Roman Emperor Constantine I in 325 AD, resulted in the first uniform Christian doctrine, called the Nicene Creed. The purpose of the council was to resolve the nature of Jesus in relationship to the Father; in particular, whether Jesus was of the same substance as God the Father or merely of similar substance.
But another consequence of the Council of Nicaea - followed by the edicts of the Council of Chalcedon and many others - was distancing the church from its Jewish roots. For instance, the council stated that if a Jew wanted to accept Jesus and be part of the church, he had to abandon the Jewish traditions and practices and even change his Jewish name!
Another result of the council was an agreement to abandon the biblical Hebrew calendar and adopt a calendar based on the vernal equinox. All of these changes began to make it impossible for a Jew to believe in Jesus and retain his or her Jewish identity.
The fact is that neither the rabbis’ nor the church’s decrees can take away someone’s Jewishness. The belief that one must stop being Jewish in order to believe in Jesus is as unsustainable as holding that a Scottish, Italian or Chinese person had to stop being Scottish, Italian or Chinese if they chose to believe in Jesus. There is nothing more biblically Jewish than to believe in the Jesus as the Jewish Messiah as described by the Jewish prophets in the Jewish Bible.
Source: chosenpeople.com
So you've siad.
But WHY?
HOW??
How about a REFORMED Jew?
An ATHEIST Jew?
Can they still be JEWS?
St. Paul would have been quite surprised at your statement.
I think you may have in mind the MORMON jesus.
No; I didn't.
What caused your change of heart?
What's up with the * replacing the 'H' in Christian?
Members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints believe in Jesus Christ as Savior and Redeemer and rely on Him for our salvation.
It doesn’t seem strange to me to consider myself a Christian — a believer in and follower of Jesus Christ.
Because Jews are not to write the names of false gods,and c*rist falls into that category.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.