Posted on 10/03/2011 9:24:36 AM PDT by jesus4life
Amen
Grace and peace to all of you. I am very new to this site. The holy spirit brought me hear tonight to look over many answers here. To learn and to share.
I have questions here if anyone would be kind to take the time out to answer:
1. If we want evil to stop, why do speak of where it is, how to see it, where to see it, and when it may happen?
2. Do we really believe GOD sees all things and will handle all things?
3. If we revere Mary as the mother of GOD, why do we not copy her obedience??
4. If we believe in CHRIST as the son of GOD, who killed no one, loved everyone, and died for all. Why do we worry about dying?? Why do we want to kill others?? Why do we hate others? Why do we want to own land, take over other countries? Why do we want to judge others faith, walk, and lives before they die, knowing that GOD has power to save and can save anyone?
5. Do we believe heaven exists?? If so, where is it for all of you??
The holy spirit brought me to some passages for all of us to think about:
The love of Christ that we should live and show the world LUKE 6:27-36
27 'But I say this to you who are listening: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who treat you badly. 29 To anyone who slaps you on one cheek, present the other cheek as well; to anyone who takes your cloak from you, do not refuse your tunic. 30 Give to everyone who asks you, and do not ask for your property back from someone who takes it. 31 Treat others as you would like people to treat you. 32 If you love those who love you, what credit can you expect? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who do good to you, what credit can you expect? For even sinners do that much. 34 And if you lend to those from whom you hope to get money back, what credit can you expect? Even sinners lend to sinners to get back the same amount. 35 Instead, love your enemies and do good to them, and lend without any hope of return. You will have a great reward, and you will be children of the Most High, for he himself is kind to the ungrateful and the wicked. 36 'Be compassionate just as your Father is compassionate.
Mary's love, obedience, and acceptance that we should all follow in situations that GOD can handle that we cant
Luke 1:29-39
29 She was deeply disturbed by these words and asked herself what this greeting could mean, 30 but the angel said to her, 'Mary, do not be afraid; you have won God's favour. 31 Look! You are to conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you must name him Jesus. 32 He will be great and will be called Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his ancestor David; 33 he will rule over the House of Jacob for ever and his reign will have no end.' 34 Mary said to the angel, 'But how can this come about, since I have no knowledge of man?' 35 The angel answered, 'The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will cover you with its shadow. And so the child will be holy and will be called Son of God. 36 And I tell you this too: your cousin Elizabeth also, in her old age, has conceived a son, and she whom people called barren is now in her sixth month, 37 for nothing is impossible to God.' 38 Mary said, 'You see before you the Lord's servant, let it happen to me as you have said.' And the angel left her. 39 Mary set out at that time and went as quickly as she could into the hill country to a town in Judah.
OUR LIVES HERE MARK 8:29-38
27 Jesus and his disciples left for the villages round Caesarea Philippi. On the way he put this question to his disciples, 'Who do people say I am?' 28 And they told him, 'John the Baptist, others Elijah, others again, one of the prophets.' 29 'But you,' he asked them, 'who do you say I am?' Peter spoke up and said to him, 'You are the Christ.' 30 And he gave them strict orders not to tell anyone about him. 31 Then he began to teach them that the Son of man was destined to suffer grievously, and to be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes, and to be put to death, and after three days to rise again; 32 and he said all this quite openly. Then, taking him aside, Peter tried to rebuke him. 33 But, turning and seeing his disciples, he rebuked Peter and said to him, 'Get behind me, Satan! You are thinking not as God thinks, but as human beings do.' 34 He called the people and his disciples to him and said, 'If anyone wants to be a follower of mine, let him renounce himself and take up his cross and follow me. 35 Anyone who wants to save his life will lose it; but anyone who loses his life for my sake, and for the sake of the gospel, will save it. 36 What gain, then, is it for anyone to win the whole world and forfeit his life? 37 And indeed what can anyone offer in exchange for his life? 38 For if anyone in this sinful and adulterous generation is ashamed of me and of my words, the Son of man will also be ashamed of him when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.'
OUR REAL HOME Revelations 21:1-8 1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; the first heaven and the first earth had disappeared now, and there was no longer any sea. 2 I saw the holy city, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride dressed for her husband. 3 Then I heard a loud voice call from the throne, 'Look, here God lives among human beings. He will make his home among them; they will be his people, and he will be their God, God-with-them. 4 He will wipe away all tears from their eyes; there will be no more death, and no more mourning or sadness or pain. The world of the past has gone.' 5 Then the One sitting on the throne spoke. 'Look, I am making the whole of creation new. Write this, "What I am saying is trustworthy and will come true." 6 Then he said to me, 'It has already happened. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give water from the well of life free to anybody who is thirsty; 7 anyone who proves victorious will inherit these things; and I will be his God and he will be my son. 8 But the legacy for cowards, for those who break their word, or worship obscenities, for murderers and the sexually immoral, and for sorcerers, worshippers of false gods or any other sort of liars, is the second death in the burning lake of sulphur.'
How much time to you spend proselytizing and debating with Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists and atheists? It is evident to me that many who spend so much time attacking the Church are not really interested in the souls of Catholics, only in elevating the status of their own belief system in comparison and competition. It looks like your motivation is far more about you than about God.
It looks like your motivation is far more about you than about God.
The fact is that i do desire the salvation or souls, and thus often express gospel that saves those who are of a broken heart and contrite spirit, and do not preach a particular church, much less me. And i have spent much time debating other beliefs, but Roman Catholicism is the major default religion, and as i am a former Roman Catholic and know both sides, and bear no personal bitterness toward her, but it is Roman Catholics that are the predominate religious party on FR in posting their beliefs and asserting her supremacy, and thus it is only fitting that i and others refute in the interest of the glory of God and His truth and the salvation of souls, which i pray to be used for.
And rather than dealing with reasons for faith, I could ask you why you resort to questioning my motivation and opine that it is selfish due to my (reasoned) arguments against her, which would only be an issue if motivation was the debate, while these charges could easily be addressed to your church and her defenders, as it is actually Rome which formally exalts herself as uniquely supreme, assuredly, perpetually infallible, with submission to her being necessary for salvation, and her apologists defend her by doing the same. And yet complain when challenged and refuted. But i need not question their motive unless that is an argument, though i think many would have us burned at the stake, as motive itself does not necessarily make an proposition of truth right or wrong.
You speak for me as well.
"To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto the word of reconciliation. Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him." 2 Cor. 5:19-21.
This is the greatest commission of all.
When you (collectively) spend all of your energies preaching to those who already fully embrace and live the Nicene Creed rather than seeking to save the souls of the truly lost you have to expect your motives to be questioned.
I would remind you from the Catechism: "There is no doctrine which could be better, more precious and more splendid than the text of the Gospel". If you disagree with that then we have nothing to discuss.
Yet you deny that with belief that the “majesterium” is a higher power than scripture.
Be it “passing” the catechism, memorizing traditions, repeating the rosary, bowing before various idols, praying to this or that saint, being familiar with various authors and their writings, honoring Rome and the Pope, attending events, confessing to Priests...and the lists go on and on.
Therefore one would ‘never’ reach the penthouse floor....they can never ‘do’enough as Rome continues to add yet more hoops to jump thru along the way.
Hebrews 10:18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
Rarely have I seen discussions or many comments from catholics about the sufficiency of Christ or the gospel message except an occasional reference to it... which would lead one to think perhaps many catholics don't understand what the gospel really is.
When I have attempted to speak with catholics in my workplace and such they have very little understanding of what Jesus says, but they are huge on attending rituals and masses to see and be part of the process which they are taught they must ‘do’.
I think most people here are trying hard to let the truth be seen and heard. As with all people who are often deceived by false teachings it's important to let the truth be seen and spoken. But each must determine if they are going to abide by what the Lord does say and teach, or by the ‘leadership and church’ and what they say one should adhere to. <p.
It's not such a good thing to have ones belief rest on any church or denomination above that of Christ Himself....it does appear, and the catholic membership does attest to this, that they are not as learned in the things of Christ as they profess to be rather they rely on what they are told to do and say...and this from the Vatican....along with various authors and traditions of the past...far more than scriptures and what Christ so clearly teaches.<p
“To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto the word of reconciliation. Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ’s stead, be ye reconciled to God. For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.” 2 Cor. 5:19-21.
HALLELUJAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Humbling verse isn't it. Nothing we have done or could do is going to change the fact ..."it is finished"...just as Jesus said....or....He did nothing at all.
There is no inbetween or in part...and we have His resurrection to prove it!
We preach that people embrace CHRIST. Not a creed, not a statement of faith, not a denomination. As long as people are embracing anything but Jesus, they are going to hell.
People need to embrace Christ and live in Christ. Creeds don't save. Christ does.
NL, most Prots (esp. evangelicals) affirm the Nicene Creed, (381 version), “one holy catholic and apostolic Church” being understood as universal and of apostolic faith, while it is much of your tribe who attacks us as in need of conversion/ Of course, there is a division here, as your have those who hold to the pre V2 understanding of Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus, or interpret Lemun Gentium accordingly and those who are more ecumenical.
I do not think that all RCs are lost, but i was lost as a one, though baptized and confirmed, and who affirmed what they told me to believe, and thus like others, i was treated as a Christian, but it was not until about age 25 that was i convicted of my lost state, without any preaching and knowing no evangelicals, but after i heard how Christ saves those who are damned and destitute i believed it by heartfelt repentance and faith, and was manifestly born again. Even nature seemed new to me.
I had been going to Mass weekly, but now i had an ongoing hunger to know how to please God from the Bible, and wanted to serve Him (and sought to as a CCD teacher and lector). But with very very rare exceptions in this heavenly RC area, i found no one who had such conversion and effects, some in the charismatic meetings i went to being but evangelical radio helped feed my soul, and after 6 years, God led me out in an evident manner in response to sincere prayer, as i was serving God, and into an evangelical church around where i used to live (there were not many) among such i found discipleship (though i am rather independent) and unique fellowship, which happens among evangelicals both spontaneously and formally across denominational lines, based upon a common shared conversion from Scripture and personal relationship with Jesus.
I am not going to give my life story, and i am not promoting myself though you infer i am, but do want the salvation of souls, and and do not believe most RCs are born again based on doctrine and their testimony, and the same is true of most Episcopalians, United Methodist and a few other from institutionalized church which are more form than reality. And no, i do not think i have arrived, but i know what scripture teaches and faith effects, and the stats back me up, besides in years past (as part of a Baptist church then) knocking on thousands of doors evangelizing, but not to make them Baptist, but born again Christians.
And i do affirm that “There is no doctrine which could be better, more precious and more splendid than the text of the Gospel” but so do Mormons, but who like Rome, effectively places themselves as the supreme assuredly infallible authority over it and by such equate another source of revelation equal to it. And that is what these debates go on. May all have a God night.
Jude 1:19
Do you embrace Scripture?
Only inasmuch as it leads me to Christ.
John 5:36-40 36But the testimony that I have is greater than that of John. For the works that the Father has given me to accomplish, the very works that I am doing, bear witness about me that the Father has sent me. 37And the Father who sent me has himself borne witness about me. His voice you have never heard, his form you have never seen, 38and you do not have his word abiding in you, for you do not believe the one whom he has sent. 39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness about me, 40yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life.
Romans 10:17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.
Galatians 3:24 So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith.
Only inasmuch as it leads me to Christ.
But those who embrace "a creed, a statement of faith, a denomination" that leads them to Christ "are going to hell"?
If they’re counting on fidelity to the creed or statement of faith to be what saves them, yes.
The creed or statement of faith is the means to the end, not the end itself. Intellectual acknowledgement and assent to a creed is not saving faith in and trusting in Christ Himself for salvation.
I've never met a person who thinks a creed saves them. I have met some Protestants who believe stating a sinner's prayer saves them.
The creed or statement of faith is the means to the end, not the end itself.
So, there are circumstances when it's ok to embrace them.
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