Joseph Smith: An Apostle of Jesus Christ

LDS.org ^ | Dennis B. Neuenschwander

[Hoodat]

Time for a scoring update.
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Mormons - 1,042
Baptists - 986
Catholics - 296
Lutherans - 87
Pentecostals - 41
Methodists - 33
Buddhists - 3
Mennonites - 2

[Colofornian]

Astounding how messed-up and twisted this cult is. It is a cult of bizarre teachings. Of peep stones and hats and golden plates that no one ever saw. Of a “prophet” who started his own bank and took not one, but many, many wives of other men. Of a “prophet” who rewrote the Bible, not with parenthetical or even marginal notations, but actually changing the words as he saw fit. Of a “prophet” who compared himself and the BoM to mohammed and the koran. This is a cult and not just a cult of personality.A cult of bizarre teachings of men with apparently no understand or regard for the Scriptures.

Thanks for your delineation of some of the most "cultish" things about the cult of Mormonism.

And yes, it's "not just a cult of personality," -- at the same, it definitively is a personality cult of Joseph Smith.

When PD just posted his "I'm-not-a-cultist-'cause-if-I-was-a-cultist-I'd-know-it" thread by Card [seriously...that's a true paraphrase of the kind of apologetic logic one of Mormonism's most famous writers has come up with!!!]...anyway, I started thinking what makes Mormonism a personality cult.

And the answer, as I was driving around, that I came up with was: Exactly what earth-moving revelations within Mormonism came from anybody other than Smith?

Oh sure...two manifestos by ensuing Lds "prophets" undid Smith's outward racism and some Mormon polygamy. But they didn't take away the racist passages in the BoM or the Pearl of Great Price or Doctrine & Covenants; nor did they take away Smith's D&C 132 celestial polygamy nor Mormonism's STILL-intact policy of eternal polygamy & future earthly polygamy!

Basically, just about everything Mormon can be traced to Smith as origin & filter!

Mormons even trust Smith over the Bible!

* Bible says hell is eternal! (Smith rejected that)
* Bible says salvation is by grace thru faith! (Smith rejected that)
* Bible says God is Spirit (John 4); (Smith rejected that by saying he has a body of flesh & bones)
* Bible says there's one TRUE God; (Smith rejected that)
* Bible says God is omnipresent; (Smith said his influence was everywhere; but not He Himself)
* Bible says God created all ex-nihilo (book of Hebrews); (Smith rejected that by saying God was a mere "organizer" of eternal matter)
* Bible says marriage for time only; (Smith said it was eternal)
* Bible says angels are distinct from men; (Smith said men became angels)
* Bible says Jesus Christ is our key filtered prophet -- and HIM ONLY now (Heb. 1:1-2); (Smith had people look to Smith as the key "prophet")
* NT says the primary temple now is the flesh & blood Body of Christ; (Smith said primary temple focus is man-made buildings Mormons put up)
Etc.

[caww]

If you asked people that have left the Church, why they left most will say because they were forced by methods of Hell and damnation if they did not go.....

When I hear that excuse, and it is a popular and EASY way out, I am reminded of the book "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God"..........even moreso the fact Christ Jesus warned more about Hell than He spoke of Heaven. Further, Most do not base their beliefs on what mans behavior is or ideas of a church. They give their life to Christ...get well acquainted with Him in the relatioship He desires...and then find a church in which to become a part of the body of believers....who are the reflection of Christ to an unsaved world. (Keeping in mind he equipps each according to his plan and purposes...not ours or someone elses idea of).

[Elsie]

There is more to life than just religion and scripture.

I believe there is more to death, as well.

[Elsie]

That soul mate thing you hear about from time to time, well, that's what we were.

At least you were not unequally yoked.

[Elsie]

I can honestly say she left to her own heaven and I plan see her again one day.

HMmm...

There are many here that wonders just how this is going to work.

[Elsie]

I think we could reconstruct the whole bom from all the passages she's cited over the years LOL.

I sure don't think so!

All she's got is a few MILK verses that she uses over and over and over and...

[Elsie]

...think, "Book of Moses. Yeah, that sounds right."

And when told that Moses forgot to take the unicorns on the ark...

[eastforker]

Well of course you can’t understand it, those are my beliefs, things that I hold dear. I am not asking you to understand or believe, how could you?

[Elsie]

Well of course you can’t understand it, those are my beliefs, things that I hold dear.

I realize that and that you haven't ask me to understand.

I merely wondered how that was going to work.

If you do not wish to elaborate, that's ok, too.

[Godzilla]

Well, if you throw in “and it came to pass”, that covers nearly half of the bom right there.

[caww]

Hi there...sure use it and reframe it anyway you like. Sadly I don’t think the one intended got it.

[caww]

Mormons don’t believe in the Biblical Christ as Savior. That’s just not true, and I feel it’s important to say so.

The only ones who believe this isn't true..are Mormons.

Mormons study Mormon-ism and Joseph Smiths' literature.

We study Christ-ianity...and it's literature.

BIG difference.

You are forgetting God says He is the 'Alpha and the Omega'....none before, now, or after than Him...... There are no other Gods beside Him.

Your religion began in a Teenagers mind and entrenchment in the occults .....Joseph Smith...He's dead.

Christianity began in the mind and heart of God,....Jesus Christ...He's alive.

[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you so much for your encouragement, dear caww!

[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you oh so very much, dear brother in Christ, for sharing your testimony and insights in the beautiful essay-post! And thank you for all of your encouragements!

[reaganaut]

As I said in earlier posts, the former LDS members are the best witnesses to preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ, to Mormons and counteract thier false doctrine with the *Truth* of the Holy Bible and Gospel of Christ, that is why I said I will bow out, because I do not know what Mormon doctrine teaches, I just know many Mormons say they are Christians and believe JOHN 14:6.

- - - - - - - -

Perhaps we are the ‘best’ to reach them. That does not give you an excuse to not try to reach them, to claim they are Christians and part of the body of Christ (as you did up thread several times).

How about LEARNING what they believe so you can witness to the ones you meet rather than ASSUME someone else will. Mayber YOU are the one to reach them.

So your ‘bowing out’, is cowardly and unchristian.

Stand for Christ.

And again, you are confusing ‘extraction’ (the you are going to hell in your face method) with witnessing (which is much gentler) but witnessing can’t come until they see that the need Jesus, a different Jesus than the one their cults claim (and they are different Christs).

With cultists (JW’s, LDS) especially the Restorationist groups, there needs to be a certain amount of extraction first. You need to get through to them that all is not well in their church, that they don’t have the ‘truth’, and that even though they SAY and believe they are Christians, their beliefs and religion are unbiblical.

So rather than sit in La-La land, do some research and get out there and help us!

[reaganaut]

BTW, since you grew up JW, do you witness to them? Or do you ‘bow out’ of that as well?

Or do they even need to be witnessed to in your opinion? Are JW’s Christians?

[reaganaut]

That is an out right lie and mindreading and a personal attack.

- - - - -
Welcome to dealing with Resty.

The LDS believe the Constitution was an inspired document, near scripture, even though it was written before Joseph Smith and his ‘restoration’ and therefore a product of the ‘apostasy’.

BTW, resty honey, the screed against Constantine and the Nicean council is getting old.

Constantine didn’t write the Nicean Creed, he just called and oversaw the council and contributed. That doesn’t make it all his. Rather the creed and other things that came out of the council were the product of the most brilliant minds of the day being LED BY GOD.

Before the LDS scream ‘traditions of men’ they need to look at how far Mormonism has changed since the 1830’s. THERE is where you see the ‘tradition of men’ take over.

Really, resty, before you start regurgitating the LDS lies about Christian history, you should do some real research. I have some resources if you are interested, since Church History IS my area.

It is the words of YOUR church that distorts Christian doctrine as Syncro quoted so well.