Posted on 12/15/2010 7:22:45 PM PST by narses
No they weren't. The American Colonies were under English Common Law, which forbade burning for 'witches'. Witches were hung, as happened in Salem. Unfortunate, but less painful.
History doesn't begin at Jamestown you know.
“John Calvin’s actions were very paganistic like his mentor, Saint Augustine.”
Huh? Who? What?
They were neither. The economic collapse that had happened between 535 and 541 throughout Western Europe, Central Asia, East Asia, and a whole lot of other places hither and yon was still in full sway.
It took Europe another 800 years to "recover".
Other people, e.g. the Arabs in the Middle East, didn't wait for Europeans to get on their feet before they acted.
**Which of the disciple’s lead did Calvin follow for torturing a fellow human being for his lack of belief???
Which of Christ’s teachings did he use to guide him when he set fire to another man???**
Well spoken!
“Ye shall know them by their fruits”.
And just like the Pope, Calvin didn’t preach Acts 2:38; not believing that one must be baptized in the NAME of JESUS Christ for the REMISSION of SINS.
If Calvin was right about predestination, he left this world, on the outside looking in, since he died without remission of sins.
That’s the exact reason Christians should never lift one man up over another. Why mention Calvin or Calvinism at all when all one needs to do is share and preach the Bible?
Calvinism as taught by many is a seriously flawed theology and unBiblical.
If Calvin was such a great Bible scholar, he should have made Geneva a refuge for others and taught in love the errors to the people of his city. He had no excuse.
Perhaps you should look behind the hyperbole and look at the facts. Geneva was a haven for the persecuted, thousands found refuge there from all sorts of persecution.
Calvin also sent out missionaries to preach the Gospel in lands where the Gospel had not yet been preached. Many of those missionaries were slaughtered for their beliefs.
As taught by some, it is indeed flawed. But as understood by most here on FR, especially by members of the GRPL, it is a pure understanding of the totality of Scripture.
***Sampson used the jawbone of an ass to slay Philistines.***
When my worthless brother-in-law (If you know him he probably owes you money) shows up at my door I feel like a Philistine when he finally departs.
***As late as the early 1600s European immigrants were still burning witches in America. ***
Actually it was the late 1600s and none were burned, they were hanged. And one man accused was crushed to death for not pleading guilty or not guilty. He merely said, “More weight!”
If he had made a plea this would have given the authorities the right to confiscate his lands and property. When he died the family still kept his property because of his no plea.
Just making a point here. Seeing the 1600s in "America" as consisting of ONLY the English colonies is rather unusual.
***Just making a point here. Seeing the 1600s in “America” as consisting of ONLY the English colonies is rather unusual.***
I’m just looking at AMERICAN witchcraft burnings. None.
In Mexico some “PIRATES” from John Hawkins’ failed slave trading expidition were burned at the stake for “heresy” and piracy but not witchcraft.
Frankly I don't care what the English did. If it helps if I had any English blood I'd gladly pull my dirk and cut a vein to let it out.
God doesn't look at context. Sin is sin. Murder is murder. It doesn't matter what the "context" was.
I, admittedly, have not studied Calvin's history. If he did indeed order the death of someone for heresy, that is sin. It doesn't matter what other people were doing at the time.
***It’s ALL AMERICA ~ we are speaking of the 1600s. Even in English language usage of the time the term still had it’s broadest meaning possible.**
I thought we were talking about burning witches in New England. None were burned there.
As for the rest of the Americas, I wouldn’t know. Pirates and heretics and one Jamestown settler who murdered his wife and ate her were burned.
And a couple of Oklahoma outlaws who were indian were burned alive by settlers.
Also a couple of supposed cattle rustlers in Nebraska were burned while being hung.
But no witches!
It’s FIVE HUNDRED years later, Shadow.
There should be a statute of limitations on Christian argument about the character and decisions of a long dead, dead guy.
In the meantime, we look foolish for hating each other over something like this.
What is time to God? We're still mortal after ...how many years?
There should be a statute of limitations on Christian argument about the character and decisions of a long dead, dead guy.
I don't care about the guy. Never did. I care about the doctrine some people spread based on his ideas. They are spreading doctrine based on a (as far as I know) non-apologetic murderer, calling themselves his name, and defending his actions.
Paul was a murderer, too. However, he repented and followed Christ and Scripture. Big difference.
In the meantime, we look foolish for hating each other over something like this.
I don't hate anyone. I dislike their doctrine, and hate the sin. But not the posters. I just wanted to correct the inference that context makes sin OK.
This is a post sure to get Christians at each other’s throats. You know I’m not a Calvinist.
I don’t know if you realize I’m an extremely strong advocate of Christian unity.
What is this, some sort of papist prayer wheel?
2:38 Peter said Hereby we see that those do never go away empty which ask at the mouth of the Lord, and do offer themselves unto him to be ruled and taught; for that promise must needs be true, Knock, and it shall be opened unto you, (Matthew 7:7.) Therefore, whosoever shall be rightly prepared to learn, the Lord will not suffer his godly desire to be in vain; for he is a most faithful master, so that he hath scholars which are apt to be taught and studious. Wherefore, there is no cause why he should fear, lest he suffer us to be destitute of sound counsel, if we be attentive and ready to hear him, and do not refuse to embrace whatsoever he shall teach us. And let us suffer ourselves to be governed by the counsel and authority of those men whom he offereth unto us to teach us, for this ready obedience cometh thence so suddenly in those which addict themselves unto the apostles, because they are persuaded that they are sent of God, to show them the way of salvation.Repent. There is greater force in the Greek word, for it doth signify the conversion of the mind, that the whole man may be renewed and made another man, which thing must be diligently noted, because this doctrine was miserably corrupted in the time of Popery; for they translated the name of repentance almost unto certain external rites. They babble somewhat, indeed, about the reigned contrition of the heart; but they touch that part very slightly, and they stand principally upon the external exercises of the body, which were little worth; yea, though there were in them no corruption; but they urge nothing else in a manner but reigned trifles, wherewith men are wearied in vain. Wherefore, let us know that this is the true repentance, when a man is renewed in the spirit of his mind, as Paul teacheth, (Romans 12:2.) Neither need we to doubt of this; but that Peter did preach plainly of the force and nature of repentance; but Luke doth only touch the chief points, and doth not reckon up the words of the oration which he made. We must, therefore, know thus much, that Peter did at the first exhort the Jews unto repentance; and that done, he lifted them up with hope of pardon; for he promised them forgiveness of sins, which two things are the two parts of the gospel, as we know full well; and, therefore, when Christ will briefly teach what the doctrine of the gospel doth contain, he saith, that repentance and remission of sins (Luke 24:47) must be preached in his name. Furthermore, because we are reconciled unto God only by the intercession of Christ’s death, neither are our sins otherwise purged, and done away, save only by his blood, therefore, Peter calleth us back unto him by name. He putteth baptism in the fourth place, as the seal whereby the promise of grace is confirmed.
Wherefore, we have in these few words almost the whole sum of Christianity, namely, how a man renouncing himself and taking his farewell of the world, may addict himself wholly to God; secondly, How he may be delivered by free forgiveness of sins, and so adopted into the number of the children of God. And forasmuch as we can obtain none of all these things without Christ, the name of Christ is therewithal set forth unto us, as the only foundation of faith and repentance. And we must also note this, that we do so begin repentance when we are turned unto God, that we must prosecute the same during our life; therefore, this sermon must continually sound in the Church, repent, (Mark 1:15;) not that those men may begin the same, who will be counted faithful, and have a place already in the Church; but that they may go forward in the same; although many do usurp the name of faithful men, which had never any beginning of repentance. Wherefore, we must observe this order in teaching, that those which do yet live unto the world and the flesh may begin to crucify the old man, that they may rise unto newness of life, and that those who are already entered the course of repentance may continually go forward towards the mark. Furthermore, because the inward conversion of the heart ought to bring forth fruits in the life, repentance cannot be rightly taught unless works be required, not those frivolous works which are only in estimation amongst the Papists, but such as are sound testimonies of innocence and holiness.
Be baptized every one of you. Although in the text and order of the words, baptism doth here go before remission of sins, yet doth it follow it in order, because it is nothing else but a sealing of those good things which we have by Christ that they may be established in our consciences; therefore, after that Peter had intreated of repentance, he calleth the Jews unto the hope of grace and salvation; and, therefore, Luke well afterwards, in Paul’s sermon, joineth faith and repentance together in the same sense, wherein he putteth forgiveness of sins in this place, and that for good considerations; for the hope of salvation consisteth in the free imputation of righteousness; and we are counted just, freely before God, when he forgiveth us our sins. And as I said before, that the doctrine of repentance hath a daily use in the Church so must we think of the forgiveness of sins, that the same is continually offered unto us; and surely it is no less necessary for us during the whole course of our life, than at our first entrance into the Church, so that it should profit us nothing to be once received into favor by God, unless this embassage should have a continual course; be-reconciled unto God, because
“he which knew no sin was made sin for us, that we might be the righteousness of God in him,” (2 Corinthians 5:20.)
Moreover, the Papists do so corrupt this other part of the gospel, that they quite exclude the remission of sins, which was to be obtained by Christ. They confess their sins are freely forgiven in baptism, but they will have them redeemed with satisfactions after baptism; and although they mix the grace of Christ together therewithal, yet because they inwrap the same in men’s merits, they do by this means overthrow the whole doctrine of the gospel; for, first, they take from men’s consciences the certainty of faith; that done, forasmuch as they part the forgiveness of sins between the death of Christ and our satisfactions, they do altogether deprive us of Christ’s benefit. For Christ doth not reconcile us unto God in part, but wholly, neither can we obtain remission of sins by him, unless it be whole and perfect. But the Papists are much deceived therein, who restrain baptism unto the nativity and former life, as if the signification and force thereof did not reach even unto death.
Let us know, therefore, that forgiveness of sins is grounded in Christ alone, and that we must not think upon any other satisfaction save only that which he hath performed by the sacrifice of his death. And for this cause, as we have already said, doth Peter express his name, whereby he doth signify unto us, that none of all these things can be rightly taught, unless Christ be set in the midst, to the end the effect of this doctrine may be sought in him. That needeth no long exposition where he commandeth them to be baptized for the remission of sins; for although God hath once reconciled men unto himself in Christ” by not imputing unto them their sins,” (2 Corinthians 5:19,) and doth now imprint in our hearts the faith thereof by his Spirit; yet, notwithstanding, because baptism is the seal whereby he doth confirm unto us this benefit, and so, consequently, the earnest and pledge of our adoption, it is worthily said to be given us for the remission of sins. For because we receive Christ’s gifts by faith, and baptism is a help to confirm and increase our faith, remission of sins, which is an effect of faith, is annexed unto it as unto the inferior mean. Furthermore, we must not fetch the definition of baptism from this place, because Peter doth only touch a part thereof. Our old man is crucified by baptism, as Paul teacheth, that we may rise unto newness of life, (Romans 6:4, 6.) And, again, we put on Christ himself, (1 Corinthians 12.) and the Scripture teacheth every where, that it is also a sign and token of repentance, (Galatians 3:27.) But because Peter doth not intreat in thin place openly of the whole nature of baptism, but speaking of the forgiveness of sins, doth, by the way, declare that the confirmation thereof is in baptism, there doth no inconvenience follow, if ye do omit the other part.
In the name of Christ. Although baptism be no vain figure, but a true and effectual testimony; notwithstanding, lest any man attribute that unto the element of water which is there offered, the name of Christ is plainly expressed, to the end we may know that it shall be a profitable sign for us then, if we seek the force and effect thereof in Christ, and know that we are, therefore, washed in baptism, because the blood of Christ is our washing; and we do also hereby gather, that Christ is, the mark and end whereunto baptism directeth us; wherefore, every one profiteth so much in baptism as he learneth to look unto Christ. But here ariseth a question, Whether it were lawful for Peter to change the form prescribed by Christ? The Papists do think, at least feign so, and thence do they take a color of liberty to change or abrogate the institutions of Christ. They confess that nothing ought to be changed, as touching the substance, but they will have the Church to have liberty to change whatsoever it will in the form. But this argument may easily be answered. For we must first know that Christ did not indite and rehearse unto his apostles magical words for enchanting, as the Papists do dream, but he did, in few words, comprehend the sum of the mystery. Again, I deny that Peter doth speak in this place of the form of baptism; but he doth simply declare that the whole strength of baptism is contained in Christ; although Christ cannot be laid hold on by faith without the Father by whom he was given us, and the Spirit by the which he reneweth and sanctifieth us. The answer consisteth wholly in this, that he intreateth not in this place of the certain form of baptizing, but the faithful are called back unto Christ, in whom alone we have whatsoever baptism doth prefigure unto us; for we are both made clean by his blood, and also we enter into a new life by the benefit of his death and resurrection.
Ye shall receive the gift of the Spirit. Because they were touched with wondering when they saw the apostles suddenly begin to speak with strange tongues, Peter saith that they shall be partakers of the same gift if they will pass over unto Christ. Remission of sins and newness of life were the principal things, and this was, as it were, an addition, that Christ should show forth unto them his power by some visible gift. Neither ought this place to be understood of the grace of sanctification, which is given generally to all the godly. Therefore he promiseth them the gift of the Spirit, whereof they saw a pattern in the diversity of tongues. Therefore this doth not properly appertain unto us. For because Christ meant to set forth the beginning of his kingdom with those miracles, they lasted but for a time; yet because the visible graces which the Lord did distribute to his did shoe, as it were in a glass, that Christ was the giver of the Spirit, therefore, that which Peter saith doth in some respect appertain unto all the whole Church: ye shall receive the gift of the Spirit. For although we do not receive it, that we may speak with tongues, that we may be prophets, that we may cure the sick, that we may work miracles; yet is it given us for a better use, that we may believe with the heart unto righteousness, that our tongues may be framed unto true confession, (Romans 10:10,) that we may pass from death to life, (John 5:24) that we, which are poor and empty, may be made rich, that we may withstand Satan and the world stoutly. Therefore, the grace of the Spirit shall always be annexed unto baptism, unless the let be in ourselves.
(John Calvin, Commentary on Acts)
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.