Posted on 10/31/2010 11:59:22 AM PDT by RnMomof7
In Christ Alone lyrics
Songwriters: Getty, Julian Keith; Townend, Stuart Richard;
In Christ alone my hope is found He is my light, my strength, my song This Cornerstone, this solid ground Firm through the fiercest drought and storm
What heights of love, what depths of peace When fears are stilled, when strivings cease My Comforter, my All in All Here in the love of Christ I stand
In Christ alone, who took on flesh Fullness of God in helpless Babe This gift of love and righteousness Scorned by the ones He came to save
?Til on that cross as Jesus died The wrath of God was satisfied For every sin on Him was laid Here in the death of Christ I live, I live
There in the ground His body lay Light of the world by darkness slain Then bursting forth in glorious Day Up from the grave He rose again
And as He stands in victory Sin?s curse has lost its grip on me For I am His and He is mine Bought with the precious blood of Christ
So, you proved my point. Thank you. The point was that you claim "Protestants" must put their spin on verses of scripture, and I showed you that you do exactly that. You HAVE to, because, to you verses in context cannot mean what they say, they have to be spun to adhere to the Catholic Church's dogmas.
Excuses, excuses.
The mistranslation in Genesis 3:15 was not simply an error, unless the translators were so incompetent that they could not distinguish the difference between *he* and *she*, in which case they wouldn’t have been qualified to translate something as simple as *Mary had a little lamb*.
They could not possibly have been so stupid to not tell the difference. Especially since they were apparently able to correctly translate the personal pronouns in the whole rest of the OT.
It had to have been deliberate.
What a pathetic, transparent attempt to shore up the idolatrous doctrine of Maryolatry. If you can’t find Scripture to support it, just make it up. If that doesn’t work, appeal to *tradition* to override Scripture.
Instead of penance every time you commit the sin, how about repenting and not doing it any more?
Or don't you think that that doesn't show that someone is sorry enough for their sin or that they don't care enough?
INDEED.
Let me ask y’all this question. Do you believe Jesus Christ is in Heaven as a human being? Is he still in the human body he wore while in his incarnated state on earth?
Metmom:Instead of penance every time you commit the sin, how about repenting and not doing it any more?
Or don't you think that that doesn't show that someone is sorry enough for their sin or that they don't care enough?
Or how about when we sin against someone we go to them and ask forgiveness of them and make amends to them for their loss, if possible? Isn't that what Christ told us?
This idea of "doing penance" comes from the "deep" thinkers of the "Church" who envisioned some "disruption in the force" kind of happening and how the sufferings of some could make up for this disruption and, all the while, totally leaving out the entire purpose of the cross of Christ.
The Sermon on the Mount is not a dissertation on how to be saved by works any more than the Law is a dissertation on how to be saved by works.
It was an expounding on the Law, showing what the true intent was. If keeping the letter of the OT Law was unable to save anyone, then what Jesus preached in the Sermon on the Mount is incapable of saving anyone because no one person, save Christ Himself, is capable of keeping the intent of the Law as presented in the Sermon on the Mount.
The Law was put into effect to lead us to Christ by showing us that we could NOT meet the righteous requirements of God and thus show us the need for a Savior.
What we earn for what we do is death and hell. Anyone who appeals to their own good works for salvation to God is going to be judged by them and that WILL result in condemnation. The only way the works could be counted as worthy is if the motivation for them were entirely pure and if the person were doing the good works to earn salvation, that would immediately disqualify them because the motivation would be self-seeking and impure.
Not only that, but since all it takes is one sin to render someone guilty of breaking the entire Law, once someone sinned one time, it wouldn’t matter if they were perfect for the entire rest of their lives. It’s too late. The wages of sin is death. All it takes is one. There is no good works outweighing bad works. That’s not God’s economy.
Galatians 2:15-21 We ourselves are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners; yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.
But if, in our endeavor to be justified in Christ, we too were found to be sinners, is Christ then a servant of sin? Certainly not! For if I rebuild what I tore down, I prove myself to be a transgressor. For through the law I died to the law, so that I might live to God. I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. I do not nullify the grace of God, for if righteousness were through the law, then Christ died for no purpose.
Galatians 3:1-29
O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? It was before your eyes that Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified. Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith? Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh? Did you suffer so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain? Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith—just as Abraham “believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness”?
Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham. And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “In you shall all the nations be blessed.” So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.
For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.” Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith.” But the law is not of faith, rather “The one who does them shall live by them.” Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”—so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.
To give a human example, brothers: even with a man-made covenant, no one annuls it or adds to it once it has been ratified. Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ. This is what I mean: the law, which came 430 years afterward, does not annul a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to make the promise void. For if the inheritance comes by the law, it no longer comes by promise; but God gave it to Abraham by a promise.
Why then the law? It was added because of transgressions, until the offspring should come to whom the promise had been made, and it was put in place through angels by an intermediary. Now an intermediary implies more than one, but God is one.
Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law. But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.
Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law, imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed. So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian, for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise.
Oh, but it's so much easier to take a few trips around the Rosary and say a few dozen Our Fathers.
I am so humbled by God's mercy and grace that he looked beyond all my faults and saw my need, like the song says. How can someone hope to stand before God with the filthy rags of their own goodness and merit and expect him to favor that over the simple child-like faith in Jesus as their Savior? "Oh, NO! That's "easy believism.", they say. How to get through to them that it is because of God's undeserved mercy, his unfathomable grace that we are not consumed?
I will not throw his grace back in his face and say, "No thanks, I'll do it my way.". I will fall upon his mercy seat with the blood of Jesus Christ washed all over every inch of me and proclaim, "Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise.". For I was lost and now am found. I was without hope and I have been given glory by his amazing grace!
If we can earn it, it’s not mercy.
If we can work off the penalty, there’s been no forgiveness, but rather the payment of a debt.
I'm sure there are those who choose to believe that because it fits their agenda rather than the facts. I'm afraid, however, you are going to have to blame Saint Jerome for the error, not those translating his Vulgate into English or German.
“He” (הוּא) in the original Hebrew is masculine. It is pronounced “hoo” and can also mean “it.” In the Septuagint, however, it was translated as autos “he,” indicating that the passage should be understood as a Messianic prophecy about Jesus Christ alone crushing the head. “He [Jesus] will crush the serpents head.”
However, St. Jerome in his Latin Vulgate translation made a major error changing “it” or “he” into “she” using the feminine pronoun ipsa instead of autos in the Latin. Roman Catholic scholars who accepted the Latin Vulgate then translated Genesis 3:15 in their Douay-Rheims Bible as:
"Inimicitias ponam inter te et mulierem, et semen tuum et semen illius: ipsa conteret caput tuum, et tu insidiaberis calcaneo eius."
I will put enmities between you and the woman, between your offspring and her offspring. She will crush your head, and you will lie in wait for her heel.”
The Neo-Vulgate (Nova Vulgata), the revised Latin version authorized by the Vatican, corrected the error and changed it from ipsa to ipsum in the Latin.
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It doesn’t matter. Regardless of the language, if the phrase is not commonly known, e.g. adios, then translate it to English.
Which is exactly to a tee what happened in my own conversion to Christ. Read the ten commandments....sense of guilt and hopelessness because if you sin in ANY of the LEAST of the commandments you are guilty of them all! Just as it is written.
What is interesting is The commandments and a few childhood stories about God and Jesus was all I knew.......and yet when I asked God to reveal Himself, if He was indeed real, and began to look in the Bible to see what it said about Him, I ran square into the commandments...and when He reveals you are doomed thru those commandments you do fear God.
But when you seek Him He will bring you beyond the commandments to Jesus as your Savior.. as your search continues. And the moment of decision is before you.
Not once was did the catholic church come into the equation....nor any of it's endless literature or writings. It was all about the scriptures, which attest of Christ, and those God brought in my path who used the scriptures, along with my own reading and study and personal prayers.
So these scripture references you have used, Metmom and Boatbums,...ring very close to my heart and mind. ......the end result, which was really the beginning,....was I said yes to Christ.
The thief on the cross next to Christ had no opportunity at all for any works....yet Christ said he'd be with Him that very day.
Hope my occult tag line is exempt..
:)
Those without the Sacrament of Holy Eucharist don’t worship as Christians have since Acts - as we also see in the Catacombs of Rome and the Church throughout history.
Remembrance only is a very recent innovation.
And without the Eucharist and Mass, “worship” becomes something quite different - lacking in worship consisting only of prayer, lecture and song.
So much of Christian worship and faith was lost for many outside the Church: Sacraments, and as in the creeds: Communion of Saints and One, Holy and Apostolic Church.
“Remembrance only is a very recent innovation”.
The ceremony Jesus instituted was quite simple, not the ritual you refer to. And it was THAT he said to do in remembrance of his death.
“And without the Eucharist and Mass, “worship” becomes something quite different - lacking in worship consisting only of prayer, lecture and song.”
Doing something in remembrance does not change what you are doing. It’s not mutually exclusive: Holy Eucharist and doing in remembrance. So the point is a non sequitur.
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