Mormon ousted as an apostate

East Valley Tribune—Phoenix, AZ, MSNBC ^ | Sept 23, 2007 | Lawn Griffiths

[sevenbak]

Correct. He sinned. I don’t understand why sevenbak is so adamant about Abraham not sinning. Mormons defend the “right” of their Prophets Joseph Smith and Brigham Young to be sinful....don’t they? Don’t we hear from them over, and over again that their Prophets are ‘only’ men and sometimes speak as men with fallen ideas and lusts? Aren’t we told that when Brigham Young spoke the Adam/God doctrine that he was just espousing erroneous beliefs. So are Prophets fallible as men, or not? not? What say ye seven?

I never said Abraham didn't sin. I said he didn't commit adultery. Jesus was the only person alive who was without sin, but God had never worked through his prophets when they disobeyed his commandments as blatantly as you accuse Abraham and the rest of doing. Righteousness is a prerequisite of obtaining the powers of heaven, it's always worked that way. Same goes for the Holy Ghost or comforter. One must at least be trying to live the commandments.

And yes, prophets are fallible as men, or course they are. No one is claiming otherwise.

[sevenbak]

So do you agree that Abraham committed the sin of adultery?

No, I do not agree. The scriptures clearly say that Hagar was his wife.

[restornu]

They really amazes me they would even to the point of trashing certain parts of the Bible it is does not fit in their corporate mind template!

Why at the same time tell us it is the Bible is inerrant word of God!

Hey gang that couldn't shoot straight you can't have it both ways!:) LOL

The only thing that condemned David it wasn't plural wives or concubines it was the murder of Uriah, murder is an unpardonable sin!

This is one thing David could not repent for because of all the light of truth he was given in life!

The long and varied discipline through which he passed in the earlier part of his life fitted him for the duties of the throne. As shepherd he acquired the habit of deep reflection; as courtier he was trained in self-control and chivalrous generosity; as outlaw he acquired knowledge of men and power of government; while each successive phase of experience developed that conscious dependence upon God which was the secret of his strength throughout his life. Like Saul he was guilty of grave crimes; but unlike Saul, he was capable of true contrition and was therefore able to find forgiveness, except in the murder of Uriah. As a consequence David is still unforgiven, but he received a promise that the Lord would not leave his soul in hell. He will be resurrected at the end of the Millennium. Because of his transgressions, he has fallen from his exaltation (D&C 132: 39).

"For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope." ~ Romans 15:4

[restornu]

Why would God demand that they commit adultery (one of those BIG sins) in order to test their faith?

Thats so backwards and you know it.

The bottom line is you reall don't to understand the ways and things of God, some perfered to lulled in a comfort zone or rest on their laurals.

Why did God ask Abraham to offer up his only Son Isaac as a sacrifice?

[Elsie]

When you are in the hole and still shoving why help!:)

No comment...

[Elsie]

FIRST, we know that a man taking the wife of a still alive man is SIN, even before the Ten Commandments are issued because of the very story you Mormonism Apologists keep harking to, namely, Abraham’s urging his wife to say she was his sister and Abimalech nearly taking her for one of his wives!

NEARLY??

Here is what Pharoh said:

Genesis 12:19
Why did you say, `She is my sister,' so that I took her to be my wife? Now then, here is your wife. Take her and go!"

[Elsie]

I see you switch from your shovel to cut and paste!

I will NOT read ANY truth about my Beloved Master
that is NOT in line with what I believe!!!

[Elsie]

He had to diddle those women!

Hey diddle diddle,
the cat in the fiddle,
the cow jumped over the moon.

[Elsie]

~”I’m sorry to tell you this, but yes Abraham WAS an adulterer. Hagar was his wife’s handmaiden and NOT his wife. That IS the very definition of adultery.”~

Alright, so you deny the prophetic calling of Abraham.

---

So NOW you are saying that ADULTERY = GOD's calling???

AMAZING!!

[Elsie]

It is not adultery when it is commanded of God, such as in the case of Abraham.

You CANNOT show any 'command of GOD' to do what you've claimed.

[Elsie]

That mischaracterization was typically dishonest.

I wouldn't quite call it this, but it IS a good example of going off on a tangent.

[Elsie]

...I do, after all, have the testimony in my soul of the Holy Ghost ....

You hope it was the HG anyway.

[Elsie]

SOMEbody sure likes them fantasy themed movies!!

The moives I have seen in the last years or so was; 6 Sense, LOTR, Harry Potter, and hope some day to The Chronicles of Narnia

[Elsie]

SOMEbody missed ‘The Passion of the Christ’?

http://www.thepassionofthechrist.com/splash.htm

[Elsie]

So Excuse me if I don’t take any of you serious!

Or ANYTHING you post; either!

[Elsie]

You left out...

"Have no Fun"

[Elsie]

In #234, you said THIS:

Yes, he did, after the Lord gave him permission through Nathan, the prophet at that time to have multiple wives. Not only that, it says in the OT,

And you've referenced THESE Scriptures to prove your point:

2 Samuel 12: 7,8
7 And Nathan said to David, Thou art the man. Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, I anointed thee king over Israel, and I delivered thee out of the hand of Saul;
8 And I gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom, and gave thee the house of Israel and of Judah; and if that had been too little, I would moreover have given unto thee such and such things.

But the problem is, GOD did NOT 'give permission' THROUGH Nathan.

Nathan was merely reminding David of what GOD had done.

[Elsie]

You and UG need to get together on this point. Read 308