Posted on 07/22/2007 7:40:38 PM PDT by xzins
I am not arguing from scripture. My argument is that the scriptures have been corurpted by man's redactions and additions and deletions and versions.
This doesn't mean the scriptures do not contain God's revealed truth. The Church has safeguarded that truth from the days of the Apostles. That is our quality control check that the Bible is understood in context and mindset of the Church stablished by Christ and not by some men 1,500 years later, or by private interpretations.
Now tell me, without resorting to scripture, why your church's beliefs have any validity whatsoever
I just did, but you have not told me why your private interpretations hold any validity, or what quality control do you have (other than some Gnostic notion of inner spirit guiding you) that the Bible as you read it, as is, as the Church put it together, is the Scripture, if you deny the Church?
“LOL Once again, we see that the RCC teaches a very impersonl salvation”
It amazes me that statements made like this are expected to be received as if they were a gospel truth.
What you have written is not the truth. And because of that fact, it isn’t something to LOL about.
(I guess I’m weary of all the lol-ing on this thread—and on this forum).
It’s implicit in everything that we do.
That’s why we have a crucifix. It is an ongoing reminder of what the sacrifice of Christ means. God is our Master. But it is because we are willing, not because He ordained it secretly, not because we are robot slaves, but because we make a daily effort to love Him and fallible as we are, we will do our best each and every day.
We are servants, not slaves. We are not mindless insects, nor are we preprogrammed mechanical devices. We choose God, or not. And that is how the Bible is supposed to be interpreted.
I’m trying to illustrate the theological mess that you people have concocted for yourselves.
Look at this:
No one deserves it, can purchase it, or even can earn it..
and
Its real and is the pearl of great price.. sell all you have and gain it
Not only does it not follow, it seems that you’re cavorting with the Mormons again.
I didn’t think that I was singing, maybe humming a little.
Persecution for persecution’s sake? That is the way of tyrants the world over. Including the brilliant and talented Jean Calvin.
The Catholic Church should never have gone to the extremes that it did. We who come after owe deep apologies to those who were unjustly persecuted. But we should never have gotten ourselves into the position where such heresies were able to sweep the earth and tuck so many earnest and upright people into the devil’s care. And that, I think, is the greater negligence.
I didn’t think that I was singing, maybe humming a little.
Persecution for persecution’s sake? That is the way of tyrants the world over. Including the brilliant and talented Jean Calvin.
The Catholic Church should never have gone to the extremes that it did. We who come after owe deep apologies to those who were unjustly persecuted. But we should never have gotten ourselves into the position where such heresies were able to sweep the earth and tuck so many earnest and upright people into the devil’s care. And that, I think, is the greater negligence.
Does the EO recommend the King James (1611) english version of the bible for those that do not read Greek? Is the KJV also riddled with errors in your opinion?
Once again your understanding falls short.
We believe in an extremely personal salvation. Each of us is to face the Lamb in Judgement. Even your examples, intended to show that man doesn’t matter in his own salvation, do.
the church validates scripture validates the church validates scripture validates the church validates scripture validates the church validates scripture validates the church...
A glorious testimony. I’m so glad to have read it.
There are enough eyes looking upon the body of Christ seeking discord. Absolutely there are groups outside the body of Christ due to severe theological flaws, but there is much unnecessary discord over interpretations that are not central to salvation.
THE KJV was translated under strict orders not to contradict the anglican church. Further ascribing grammatic properties of English words to words translated into English from other languages is naive.
folks looking to insist on a literalist interpretation of scripture should learn the literal langauge used in writing it.
But when the Pharisees heard [it], they said, This [fellow] doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils. – Matthew 12:24
Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy. - Matthew 26:65
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. – 2 Timothy 3:5
Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great [is] your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you. – Matthew 5:11-12
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with [him], that we may be also glorified together. - Romans 8:14-17
Praise God!!!
Indeed, Christ tells us to receive all of Scripture!
You seem obsessed to have everyone acknowledge your scholarship, offering broad assertions such as, “[the] Bible ... show(s) that human hands left singificant fingerprints on the scriptures, all of which amount to corruption.” Let us look at that assertion from God’s perspective. Yes, men have corrupted the written directions dictated (in a manner of speaking), the most gross being the Masoretic texts where Jews decided to edit out anything that one might construe as referring to Rabbi Jesus. But that begs the question of how could men defeat God’s sovereign plans? Is it so easy to edit out what God actually is instructing with the scriptures? You would answer that with a strong affirmative as evidenced by your many references to corruption and inferences that the texts cannot be trusted to do that which God intends. I would offer in reply that you do not actually understand what it is that God does with His words in the believer and what it is that He has designed into the Word such that even the corrupting you claim has not diminished the utility to which God directs His Word. You would make a good heretic because you consider your own counsel to be superior to anything you don’t comprehend in God’s economy.
From an Orthodox website (http://www.lxx.org/): "We are taking the New King James Version as a starting point -- "boilerplate" you might say -- and changing it everywhere it is different from the Septuagint. The result will indeed be a Septuagint translation."
Are they also naive? I have read on other EO sites that the KJV is recommended for NT study. More naivety?
“or what quality control do you have (other than some Gnostic notion of inner spirit guiding you)”
And what “quality” control check do you have over the church’s interpretation of the truth? Is it the same “Gnostic” notion of inner spirit guiding them?
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