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To: jo kus

>>>>There will not be any self boasting in Heaven... All there will confess that they owe 100% of their soul's salvation to Christ and what he accomplished by His own death, burial, and resurrection.<<<<

>>That is true in a sense.<<

It's Biblical theology, my friend.

>>But we are not saved by Christ's grace and work if we refuse His graces. We ALWAYS have the ability to reject the Spirit - until the day we die. While even this choice is molded by God Himself, there is still a sense of cooperation in my choice to follow God or to follow my own self. Again, nothing that I do ALONE is salvific. But in Christ, I am a new creation - my actions are raised to a new level, as Christ is working within me the will and ability to do meritorious deeds.<<

For the sake of argument.. Let's say that what you are trying say is true.. Has there ever been a time in your own personal life where you believed that you you had done enough "meritorious deeds" to warrant God's salvation?

For the sake of argument... Let's say (and I admit that this is speculation on my part).. Let's say that you felt that you had reached a point where you have been able to say... Yes, I believe that I have done enough "meritorious deeds"... What standard do you use to come to such a conclusion?

Remember... We're talking about our own personal standing before God.. Not man's estimation of whether or not we "measure up"... Do you have an "assurance verse" that tells you when, by your own "meritorious deeds" that you possess eternal life?



56 posted on 08/10/2006 10:03:21 PM PDT by politicallyincarrect ( (Darwinism is the Religion of Atheists))
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To: politicallyincarrect
Has there ever been a time in your own personal life where you believed that you you had done enough "meritorious deeds" to warrant God's salvation?

NO! That is one of the worst sins, the sin of religious pride. Whatever I do, even in Christ, doesn't earn me salvation. I do, however, understand that God is righteous and has promised me a reward IF I heed His commandments to love my neighbors and Him. I am not OWED anything, no matter what I do. This attitude is unlike the one who presumptuously says "I'm saved already for heaven". This is not biblical. "Being saved", in the past tense, refers to entrance into the Church, being freed from the slavery of sin and being made children of God. It does NOT follow, however, that such a one will receive the reward in heaven. Christ makes that perfectly clear in several parables, particularly the three in Matthew 25, but also the weeds and the wheat.

Let's say that you felt that you had reached a point where you have been able to say... Yes, I believe that I have done enough "meritorious deeds"... What standard do you use to come to such a conclusion?

We don't. Catholic teaching says that a man can NEVER merit the reward of 'final perseverance'. We can be optimistically confident that we have obeyed God - but we rely on God's righteousness to reward us, not that God owes us for being good. There is a difference! One must ask for salvation - it is never owed us! Even the greatest of saints have said as much. EVEN THEY were not or could not say for certain that they were heaven-bound upon their deaths. That is because Catholics realize that God is sovereign and we cannot place God in debt.

Do you have an "assurance verse" that tells you when, by your own "meritorious deeds" that you possess eternal life?

No. Salvation is not assured. God will judge us based on the direction of our lives, e.g. Matthew 25:31-45. We can be sure that the Spirit is within us if we are obeying the Commandments (which we can only do as a result of Him within us) and we know that we will not be condemned if He abides in us (1 John 5:12). However, this confidence does not translate into an assurance - that places God in a debtor position. The wages of sin is death, eternal life is a gift. Gifts are not owed us, no matter OUR faith or love...

Regards

58 posted on 08/11/2006 5:54:56 AM PDT by jo kus (Humility is present when one debases oneself without being obliged to do so- St.Crysostom - Phil 2:8)
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To: politicallyincarrect
Has there ever been a time in your own personal life where you believed that you you had done enough "meritorious deeds" to warrant God's salvation?

You're missing the point entirely. The acts he's calling "meritorious" are those performed by the justified. He doesn't need to perform any acts to earn salvation, he already has it.

The Council of Trent's first canon on justification flatly denies that justification can be earned by keeping the law apart from divine grace.

67 posted on 08/11/2006 8:56:20 AM PDT by Campion ("I am so tired of you, liberal church in America" -- Mother Angelica, 1993)
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