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To: InterestedQuestioner
Actually, the Bible doesn't say we're saved by faith alone,

Why do you refuse to see the verses dealing with salvation say nothing about faith PLUS works, or the church, or something else? I see on this thread and the previous one you have NO Bible verses that say that salvation is through faith and works.

it says we're not saved by faith alone.

You have continuously brought up James 2:24, and here and the previous thread, explanations were given. Explantions like: Paul is talking to the saved, the context of the whole chapter, the word in the verse is justified (not saved as you indicate)which means to demonstrate,etc., but your response is the same "salvation through faith ALONE is not in the Bible."

The reference here is correct, Luther did indeed add his teaching to the Bible when he translated it.

This is an interesting topic. One which deserves more then a brief summary, but here it is in a nut shell...I, and most others I see here, are not basing our belief on the writtings of a mortal man named Luther, but on the teachings of Jesus in the Bible.

He also effectively removed the part of the Bible that says we are saved not by faith alone. To be correct, "salvation by faith alone" is what men say, saved "not by faith alone is what God's word says.

This discussion also deals with what is your Bible based on. The 1611 King James Bible is based on over 3000 Greek manuscripts that colaborate each other,not the writtings of Luther. From what I have been able to find out so far, the Catholic Bible is based on 3 manuscripts that are full of omissions and errors. So when you and I disagree on the meaning of a word or a verses origin, our sources are different.
59 posted on 09/02/2005 12:39:18 PM PDT by ScubieNuc
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To: ScubieNuc
"Why do you refuse to see the verses dealing with salvation say nothing about faith PLUS works, or the church, or something else?"

Yes they do:
"You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone." --Jas 2:24
Moreover, there are many others, but this one is particularly explicit. The formulation saved by faith alone occurs nowhere is Scripture, correct?

"Paul is talking to the saved, the context of the whole chapter."

I don't remember being told that, but you've put your case very well here. I'm quite concerned and more than a little bit puzzled over the use of the term "saved" here, and I think it's creating a misunderstanding. Do you believe that, after having a sincere belief that Jesus is Lord at the time of conversion, you are guaranteed to go to Heaven when you die? Is this what you mean by "saved"? I don't see that in Scripture, and would be curious as to where you are seeing that. As to the audience in the Epistle of James, it is traditionally referred to as one of the catholic Epistles, which means that it pertains to all.

"your response is the same "salvation through faith ALONE is not in the Bible.""

Indeed, that's because the Bible nowhere says we are saved by faith alone. Or would you care to show me a single verse that says we are saved by faith alone? One verse is all I would need.

"I, and most others I see here, are not basing our belief on the writtings of a mortal man named Luther, but on the teachings of Jesus in the Bible."

I must insist upon this point, the teaching that we are saved by faith alone is Luther's invention, and no other's. It was invented in the 16th century, and is not in the Bible. Your belief system, to the extent that it differs from Catholicism, is indeed based upon the teachings of a mortal man, namely Martin Luther.
63 posted on 09/02/2005 1:19:44 PM PDT by InterestedQuestioner ("Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved.")
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