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Contribution to a Canonization
Tradition in Action | Marian T. Horvat

Posted on 12/14/2004 7:53:38 PM PST by Land of the Irish

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1 posted on 12/14/2004 7:53:38 PM PST by Land of the Irish
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To: Akron Al; Alberta's Child; Andrew65; AniGrrl; apologia_pro_vita_sua; attagirl; BearWash; ...

Ping

http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/a006ht.htm


2 posted on 12/14/2004 7:55:51 PM PST by Land of the Irish (Tradidi quod et accepi)
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To: Land of the Irish
LOL!!! These two banshees take off after John XXIII, and say nothing of Pius IX's kidnapping of a Jewish boy and his forced conversion to the Church.

Traditio and The Remanant get nuttier by the day.

3 posted on 12/14/2004 8:04:09 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: sinkspur
These two banshees...

Two? Seeing double again?

4 posted on 12/14/2004 8:14:48 PM PST by Land of the Irish (Tradidi quod et accepi)
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To: Land of the Irish

Guimares and Horvat. Or did you not even read your own article?


5 posted on 12/14/2004 8:16:05 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: sinkspur
Pius IX's kidnapping of a Jewish boy and his forced conversion to the Church.

It's no surprise that the trads aren't opposed to it:

In this case, indeed, they ought not to be baptized, but be sent back to those in whose power and trust they are lawfully placed. But, if they have been already admitted to the sacrament, either they must be detained or recovered from their Hebrew parents and handed over to the faithful of Christ, so that they may be piously and religiously trained by them; for this is the effect of baptism, which, though it be unlawful, nevertheless is true and valid. (Benedict XIV, "Postremo mense", DS 1490)

6 posted on 12/14/2004 8:25:45 PM PST by gbcdoj ("I acknowledge everyone who is united with the See of Peter" - St. Jerome)
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To: sinkspur

"These two banshees take off"

Are you upset at the lack of tribute to your 2 heroes - Kasper and Kung?


7 posted on 12/14/2004 8:32:41 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: gbcdoj

"It's no surprise that the trads aren't opposed"

It's even less of a surprise that modernists managed to get John XIII beatified....
http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/a006bIncorruptPopeht.htm


8 posted on 12/14/2004 8:35:33 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: sinkspur
I read it.

One author; many quotes.

Are Tramontin, Gottardi, Congar, Kung, et al, "banshees"?

You always ignore the facts and dish the source.

9 posted on 12/14/2004 8:36:04 PM PST by Land of the Irish (Tradidi quod et accepi)
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To: Land of the Irish

I had this vague impression observing from outside the looking glass that beatification/cannonization was something about miracles witnessed here on earth, and not about serving as a vehicle for waging PC/RC internecine backbiting. Am I suffering from a misapprehension here?


10 posted on 12/14/2004 8:36:41 PM PST by Torie
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To: Torie

I agree; your impression is vague.


11 posted on 12/14/2004 8:43:29 PM PST by Land of the Irish (Tradidi quod et accepi)
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To: Land of the Irish

Well, at least we agree on something. I take it you don't want to help me make it less vague, which is certainly a reasonable exercise of your perogative. There are just so many fuzzy wuzzies out there, and so little time.


12 posted on 12/14/2004 8:45:46 PM PST by Torie
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To: AskStPhilomena
This contribution is not an attempt to make a definitive judgment on so weighty a matter

But now the Church has judged, and judged well.

Nevertheless, with the opinion of higher probability having been supposed because beatification is not a judgment concerning the sanctity of some man, but only a permission that he can be revered and venerated publicly, I judge that the pontiff cannot err practically in such beatification, so he is temarious and scandalous, who refuses such honor, or does not affirm that such worship must be tendered. (John of St. Thomas, II-II, q. 1 to 7; disp. 3, a. 2, no. 19)

13 posted on 12/14/2004 8:49:17 PM PST by gbcdoj ("I acknowledge everyone who is united with the See of Peter" - St. Jerome)
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To: Torie

"There are just so many fuzzy wuzzies out there, and so little time."

This may assist you in your struggle to make sense of the modern "saint factory"...
http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/k00CanonizationsIndex.html


14 posted on 12/14/2004 8:59:16 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: AskStPhilomena

John Paul II also beatified Pius IX, an acknowledged kidnapper.


15 posted on 12/14/2004 9:00:31 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: AskStPhilomena
Italian and international Jewish groups have protested Pius' beatification in large part because of the 1858 taking of 6-year-old Edgardo Mortara by papal guards. Church officials ordered the boy removed from his Jewish family in Bologna after hearing he had been secretly baptized by a Catholic housemaid.

Under Pius' patronage, Edgardo grew up a church ward and later a priest.

"That mother was deprived of her son," Giacomo Saban, an Italian Jewish leader, told the crowd. "The injury is still alive. It's still felt."

Other speakers read from passages of Pius' writing, including one in which he allegedly wrote Jews were not citizens but "dogs."

Source.

You apparently have no problem with this.

16 posted on 12/14/2004 9:04:42 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: sinkspur

The Talmud Unmasked...
http://www.talmudunmasked.com/


17 posted on 12/14/2004 9:20:20 PM PST by AskStPhilomena
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To: AskStPhilomena

LOL!!! What nonsense.


18 posted on 12/14/2004 9:23:48 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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To: gbcdoj; Land of the Irish
"In this case, indeed, they ought not to be baptized, but be sent back to those in whose power and trust they are lawfully placed. But, if they have been already admitted to the sacrament, either they must be detained or recovered from their Hebrew parents and handed over to the faithful of Christ, so that they may be piously and religiously trained by them; for this is the effect of baptism, which, though it be unlawful, nevertheless is true and valid. (Benedict XIV, "Postremo mense", DS 1490)

I have an idea, let's replace the words "Hebrew parents" with apostate, heretic, or dissenting Catholic parents and implement this right away!

19 posted on 12/14/2004 9:29:30 PM PST by murphE ("I ain't no physicist, but I know what matters." - Popeye)
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To: murphE
I have an idea, let's replace the words "Hebrew parents" with apostate, heretic, or dissenting Catholic parents and implement this right away!

Go ahead. You'll be doing 5-10 for kidnapping.

20 posted on 12/14/2004 9:32:46 PM PST by sinkspur ("It is a great day to be alive. I appreciate your gratitude." God Himself.)
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