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To: nickcarraway

"Sheila Dabu is a Toronto freelance writer with a special interest in Catholicism."

She could do to take some serious study of her subject before spouting forth, however!

"Post-Vatican II theology says the celebrating community offers the sacrifice to God with the priest."

This is sheer bunk - no official teaching of the Church since Vatican II has claimed this.

"In 2003, bans on three of the four bishops illicitly consecrated by Lefebvre were lifted."

This is news to me - has anyone else heard anything to this effect or is she just spouting more nonsense?

I assume by "ban" she means excommunication. (Not that I am trying to start up another "are they/aren't they" debate - simply querying whether the Vatican has officially changed its stance).


3 posted on 08/31/2004 5:50:46 AM PDT by Tantumergo
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To: Tantumergo
I assume by "ban" she means excommunication. (Not that I am trying to start up another "are they/aren't they" debate - simply querying whether the Vatican has officially changed its stance).

No. The decree of excommunication has not been lifted. Of course, to any right-thinking Catholic, the "excommunication" lacked foundation & hence validity from the start.
4 posted on 08/31/2004 10:17:39 AM PDT by latae sententiae (Last Things first!)
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To: Tantumergo
She could do to take some serious study of her subject before spouting forth, however!

I think she has done a rather good job putting the whole complicated situation into a nutshell. About the best you could expect from any secular news source, and much better than you could expect from any organ of the hierarchy.

"Post-Vatican II theology says the celebrating community offers the sacrifice to God with the priest."
This is sheer bunk - no official teaching of the Church since Vatican II has claimed this.

In actual fact, every teaching since Vatican II that comes from any kind of liturgical organization makes exactly this claim. I have a book called "The Communion Rite at Sunday Mass" by Gabe Huck that says precisely this. Right on the first page he says,

"Our eucharist is always the eucharist of the church [sic]. It has no existence apart from the celebration of particular assemblies."
This book has more than just an imprimatur, it is actually copyrighted by the Archdiocese of Chicago. It is published by Liturgy Training Publications, the organization that supplies liturgy materials for nearly all the parishes in the United States. I can tell you that virtually every "suggestion" in this book was implemented in the New Mass parish we used to attend.

The bishops are part of the official magisterium of the Church, and this is what they are teaching and practicing in every diocese around the world.

6 posted on 08/31/2004 1:40:33 PM PDT by Maximilian
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